Page 1 of 1
Won't turn over unless clutch is engaged
Posted: Tue Jun 28, 2022 10:25 pm
by Harry
My 444 has a Kohler 321 with a starter generator and all of a sudden the other day wouldn't turn over unless the clutch was engaged. It will start with the clutch engaged and as soon as it starts I disengage it. The wiring all seems to be in order according to the schematic and it's confusing to me why all of a sudden this is happening.
Anyone that has any ideas please send reply's ASAP?
Keep the Peace
Harry
Re: Won't turn over unless clutch is engaged
Posted: Tue Jun 28, 2022 11:02 pm
by Spike188
@Harry is this a manual clutch? I am thinking there is malfunction in the Clutch engaged safety switch or wiring to that switch.
Re: Won't turn over unless clutch is engaged
Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2022 2:17 am
by DavidBarkey
Harry , Are you using a 5 pin relay to run the electric clutch wired in to the safety switches ? If so change the relay .
Re: Won't turn over unless clutch is engaged
Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2022 5:36 am
by propane1
Just a guess, but bad engine to frame ground.
Noel
Re: Won't turn over unless clutch is engaged
Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2022 6:40 am
by DavidBarkey
Propane57 wrote: ↑Wed Jun 29, 2022 5:36 am
Just a guess, but bad engine to frame ground.
Noel
Not a bad guess ,or to the starter from block . A jumper cable from battery to block then starter would confirm that .
Re: Won't turn over unless clutch is engaged
Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2022 7:12 am
by Harry
This 444 has a manual clutch. I'll have to check the ground situation, then take out the battery and battery box to get into the safety switch.
Thanks to all who replied.
Keep the Peace
Harry
Re: Won't turn over unless clutch is engaged
Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2022 10:17 am
by Eugen
The weird part is that it behaves exactly the opposite of what the contact switch should do. Either something happened to the switch, or the wiring to the switch got pinched? You said you already checked the wires and they're fine, so that only leaves the switch itself. If you have better access perhaps you can jumper the switch over with a wire, on the other side where you have more access. That would tell you exactly that the switch or the wiring to it is the problem.
Re: Won't turn over unless clutch is engaged
Posted: Wed Jun 29, 2022 3:39 pm
by Harry
I had a few minutes today so I tried a jumper cable from the battery to the block and then the battery to the starter generator and it made no difference. So I guess I will take out the battery and the battery box to get into the switch and see what's going on in there.
This GT was free to me when I purchased the rototiller that was on the back. The PO said it just stopped running and he parked it behind his barn. I've found a few other issues that would have made it stop running so far. On with the debugging to get this rascal back working as it should. Thanks for the suggestions guys!
Keep the Peace
Harry
Re: Won't turn over unless clutch is engaged
Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2022 2:37 pm
by Harry
I took out the battery and the tray to get to the switch. Moved the clutch engagement lever and could see the switch was closed when lever engaged and open when disengaged. So I disassembled the contacts and cleaned them up with emery cloth, then reassembled and adjusted so the swith was open when engaged and closed when disengaged. All back together and working fine now. I think I have most of the bugs worked out now, but never say never.
Keep the Peace
Harry
Re: Won't turn over unless clutch is engaged
Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2022 2:40 pm
by Eugen
Good troubleshooting
@Harry ! Glad it's fixed!
Re: Won't turn over unless clutch is engaged
Posted: Thu Jun 30, 2022 8:45 pm
by DavidBarkey
I guess someone thought open was the new closed
Re: Won't turn over unless clutch is engaged
Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 6:17 pm
by Harry
I think it got bent somehow. After I fixed the switch so it turns over like it's supposed to, it cranked but wouldn't start. It had spark at the plug fuel at the carb but a compression test showed only 20 lbs. Crazy tractor chasing these bugs.
I pulled the head off this morning and the heead gasket showed leakage. I was lucky to find one this morning and picked up a can of the copper head gasket sealant. Put it all back together using the torque sequence, waiting a little betwen torques. Fired up ran for awhile then shut it off and retorqed the head bolts. I'm wondering what I'll find next as I'm working the bugs out!
Keep the Peace
Harry
Re: Won't turn over unless clutch is engaged
Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 7:23 pm
by Eugen
@Harry, how did you check compression? The 444 has automatic compression release.
Re: Won't turn over unless clutch is engaged
Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2022 10:05 pm
by JSinMO
Harry wrote: ↑Fri Jul 01, 2022 6:17 pm
I think it got bent somehow. After I fixed the switch so it turns over like it's supposed to, it cranked but wouldn't start. It had spark at the plug fuel at the carb but a compression test showed only 20 lbs. Crazy tractor chasing these bugs.
I pulled the head off this morning and the heead gasket showed leakage. I was lucky to find one this morning and picked up a can of the copper head gasket sealant. Put it all back together using the torque sequence, waiting a little betwen torques. Fired up ran for awhile then shut it off and retorqed the head bolts. I'm wondering what I'll find next as I'm working the bugs out!
Keep the Peace
Harry
I know it can be aggravating to chase down gremlins, but it sounds like you have it well on the way to being back in service. Might end up being a pretty good machine!