Colt Case Ingersoll Garden Tractors

oliver244 wrote: ↑Mon Aug 26, 2024 6:23 pm Forgive me for a "What's it Worth" post.
I know location, condition, etc has a lot to do with price.
So I've had a Case Loader on my Wish List for a long time. They rarely pop up for sale around me, or within Texas for that matter.
This one just popped up. Their asking $1250
From the pictures I can see:

THE BAD
All 3 cylinder rods are rusted beyond use. New cylinders Est $800
Hydraulic hoses look sun rotten
Engine missing intake and carb, probable a basket case. $2000 or more
Tires are worn and at least one off its rim Est $700
Seat is shot $150

THE GOOD
Loader bucket is straight
overall tractor is straight doesn't look abused, just neglected.
Has a weight box.
Not overly rusted.

I've done a couple of Wheel horse full nut and bolt restoration's.
But this would be the biggest project I've thought about taking on.
I have a mid 60's White/Oliver 2-44 Industrial Loader backhoe that I did quite a bit on, and have at the family farm.
(hence my user name "Oliver 2-44")
So I know how useful even a small loader could be around the house and a few acres.
But its a beast to haul back and forth a 100 miles.

Let know what you think

case 646 left side.jpg
case 646 rear.jpg
case 646 engine.jpg
case 646 onan.jpg
case 646 side.jpg

oliver244 wrote: ↑Mon Aug 26, 2024 6:23 pm Forgive me for a "What's it Worth" post.
I know location, condition, etc has a lot to do with price.
So I've had a Case Loader on my Wish List for a long time. They rarely pop up for sale around me, or within Texas for that matter.
This one just popped up. Their asking $1250
From the pictures I can see:

THE BAD
All 3 cylinder rods are rusted beyond use. New cylinders Est $800
Hydraulic hoses look sun rotten
Engine missing intake and carb, probable a basket case. $2000 or more
Tires are worn and at least one off its rim Est $700
Seat is shot $150

THE GOOD
Loader bucket is straight
overall tractor is straight doesn't look abused, just neglected.
Has a weight box.
Not overly rusted.

I've done a couple of Wheel horse full nut and bolt restoration's.
But this would be the biggest project I've thought about taking on.
I have a mid 60's White/Oliver 2-44 Industrial Loader backhoe that I did quite a bit on, and have at the family farm.
(hence my user name "Oliver 2-44")
So I know how useful even a small loader could be around the house and a few acres.
But its a beast to haul back and forth a 100 miles.

Let know what you think

oliver244 wrote: ↑Thu Aug 29, 2024 4:36 pm The Case 644 used a 14hp Kohler K321 single cylinder engine.
I have 2 Kohler 16hp k341's which have the same size block.
How much would have to change to install one of my k341's

myerslawnandgarden wrote: ↑Thu Aug 29, 2024 10:31 pm I can't give very accurate information on the spot, but I can tell you the the K321 and K341 blocks are entirely different, the K341 has a much higher crankshaft height for example. Not sure how it compares to the CCKA. Nothing is impossible, given enough time and effort. I would suggest that the pto side of the K341 will not accept the standard pump mount as used on the GT's and 644. that bracket would have to be fabricated and the frame modified to get the crankshaft height correct. Also, the Kohlers used on the Case/Ingersoll models all were narrow blocks with the modified oil pan as designated by the "A" after the K321 etc. K341's were never offered that way so all have the 2 quart pan which gives you an even higher crankshaft position before even considering the taller block.

Bob

Spike188 wrote: ↑Fri Aug 30, 2024 8:52 pm @MattA The 648 had a dual pump head. One pump was for the power stearing and the other for travel, loader, and attachements.

Spike188 wrote: ↑Fri Aug 30, 2024 8:52 pm @MattA The 648 had a dual pump head. One pump was for the power stearing and the other for travel, loader, and attachements.

sdunt wrote: ↑Sun Sep 01, 2024 9:38 am The larger HP in the 646/648 vs the 644 was IMO mainly for running a tiller or other hydraulic attachment.

As has been pointed out the loader, or backhoe can't really tax the engine.. the only thing that can keep the 16 HP onan in my 646 busy is the Tiller.

Harry wrote: ↑Mon Sep 02, 2024 10:25 am I used the tiller on the 646 with the CCK once and wasn’t happy with the results on my hard clay soil. I also tried it on the 444 with the K321, same results. So it’s slower to use the Troybilt with the Honda 13hp but it does a terrific job. Harry

Eugen wrote: ↑Mon Sep 02, 2024 4:18 pm

Harry wrote: ↑Mon Sep 02, 2024 10:25 am I used the tiller on the 646 with the CCK once and wasn’t happy with the results on my hard clay soil. I also tried it on the 444 with the K321, same results. So it’s slower to use the Troybilt with the Honda 13hp but it does a terrific job. Harry

Haha, I guess I cheated a little by doing a moldboard plough run before the tiller.

myerslawnandgarden wrote: ↑Thu Aug 29, 2024 10:31 pm I can't give very accurate information on the spot, but I can tell you the the K321 and K341 blocks are entirely different, the K341 has a much higher crankshaft height for example. Not sure how it compares to the CCKA. Nothing is impossible, given enough time and effort. I would suggest that the pto side of the K341 will not accept the standard pump mount as used on the GT's and 644. that bracket would have to be fabricated and the frame modified to get the crankshaft height correct. Also, the Kohlers used on the Case/Ingersoll models all were narrow blocks with the modified oil pan as designated by the "A" after the K321 etc. K341's were never offered that way so all have the 2 quart pan which gives you an even higher crankshaft position before even considering the taller block.

Bob

ssmewing wrote: ↑Thu Sep 19, 2024 4:52 pm I am jumping in here. Sorry, I have not been around in a while.

I have a 646 that I got when I was just buried in other people's tractors. I drove it on the trailer, drove it off the trailer, and parked it about 5-7 years ago. What I remember the most about it is that the thing spun so freely by the starter. It would start, but it just did not seem to have any confidence. It was a deal where there was buying back a tractor that I had fixed up, and it was just a good running tractor, and it just came with a blower. The guy decided he had to go bigger because he lives in the snow belt in northern MI.

He offered me the tractor I fixed up for close to what I charged him and wanted me to also take the 646 he had that he was thinking about having me fix up until he decided to go bigger. I got both for $1,300. That was his price. I pretty much was driving the car to the trailer at that point. So, I quickly listed the tractor with the caster for $1,300, and a guy who also lived up in the snow belt bought it the day I listed it. So, the buyer picked up the tractor from the seller, to me, and paid him the $1,300. So, I looked at the guy who asked me to buy back his tractor and buy his loader with him, knowing that I was getting the loader for free, and I had to ask him if want some extra money now. He took $100 and was happy that the horse trading happened in one day. That was his goal when he called me.

He told me that the loader was tired. It seemed that way when I drove it a little.

But wait, there's more. The 646 does have a rusted bucket at the back where You left it outside and allowed water to fill the bucket. I was just thinking I would add some flat stock and burn some rods to build it back up. Shortly after this, another guy who knew me called and said he was switching his Case loader over to all quick-attach. I mean buckets and everything else. All he had was the original bucket. He said it was in great shape, and he would drop it off for $200. I said it sounds great.

At this time, I had a 644 that I rebuilt. I bought it for $500, and I worked very hard. I swapped the older 14hp Kohler to the newer one that had been rebuilt, and then I cannot remember what happened to that tractor, but it was expensive. I got that for $200, took the motor, and sold the rest for $200. After swapping the engines, I had the older-style one to get rid of, and I sold that for $200. I often wanted more power. I will soon see if the 648 I have will dig harder.

I still have a bucket that has some rust but is otherwise in great shape. I will get at least $400 for it. Just a front blade is more than $200.

During all this, I learned that some brand new CCK short blocks were being sold for $599 shipped. I called Boomer to help me pick the best one for the 646 and bought it. This means I should be close to having a 646 with a new short block with no money in it. I just do not know if I will be able to get all the gaskets and such from Boomer. He has told some that he is retired. We talked. He has some adjusting to do.

So, now I have a 648 with not too many hours on it. But it has some age and use issues that will be a separate thread. It is on jack stands right now.