Colt Case Ingersoll Garden Tractors

We’ll it’s raining like a cow peeing on a flat rock so I don’t know it my new grain truck is coming home today. That being the case it’s a great time to come up to shop and start in on the 446.

I figured I’d start by just kinda drinking it in. First thing that hit me is, I can’t stand that steering wheel! I guess that a minor complaint at this point. I see some really bad wiring choices. The oil is black but no water in it. Has hydraulic oil. And I see a leak coming from somewhere in back, so it fits in perfectly around here! Steering has been cobbled together and seems a bit loose, but what can you expect right?

At least one of the cats seems to approve I decided to start checking things out. I hooked a battery up and twisted the key… nothing no crank. So I hooked a batty direct to the starter
Now that I knew I could crank it. I pulled the plugs and checked compression. Yep has pretty good comprehension!
I cleaned the plugs up and hooked the battery back to the tractor and turned the key to run and ran a jumper across the solenoid. Engine cranks, and I have good spark! Well I can’t stop now! I poured a little gas down the throat of the carburetor and again jumped across the solenoid. It stared right up! I know you can’t tell by a picture but it’s running! Can’t believe it. That about the easiest get it running project I’ve ever had! Hydraulics work I drove it around a bit. So now it’s full steam ahead! It needs a starter solenoid and wiring, fresh fluids, and we should probably check the rear end. Pretty good results for a short time in the shop!

lights work too!

Jeff, You hit one out of the park on this purchase. Those speaker 77 glass head lamps are getting $$$ and hard to find.

I find that first look at a new to you old tractor quite exciting, like opening presents when you were a kid. And if the motor starts it's wow! Happy to see you got a nice one here!

running and driving, good compression, makes the deal even sweeter.
Hard to know what you're buying when you can't really get into it.
Tim

Sometimes the ones you think might be an unwise purchase turn out to be the opposite. Great score!

Congrats! Hard to believe it was so simple to get running! What a great deal.

I agree with you on the steering wheel being pretty awful. It would help a lot if the chrome were just painted a satin black.

Even better you could bend three identical sheet metal covers to lay over the steering wheel spokes to make them appear as though they are solid flat metal. Instead of those awful racing holes!

thebuildist wrote: ↑Wed Sep 07, 2022 6:20 pm Congrats! Hard to believe it was so simple to get running! What a great deal.

I agree with you on the steering wheel being pretty awful. It would help a lot if the chrome were just painted a satin black.

Even better you could bend three identical sheet metal covers to lay over the steering wheel spokes to make them appear as though they are solid flat metal. Instead of those awful racing holes!

I’m not a very skilled fabricator. If I made covers I’d end up with 3 more rattles that would drive me nuts! I’m liking your black paint idea! At least for now

I came home this evening and spent some time chasing gremlins. I replaced the solenoid and put a proper battery in. Cleaned up some of the wiring. It ain’t pretty, but it functions. I still have an intermittent no crank happening but I’m thinking it’s still have a bad connection at the switch.

I really wanted to see the blade on the tractor so I took the home made carry all off the front. I happened to have a piece of C channel the fit the 3 point, so I tacked it to the box now it’s a carry all / weight box. I’m liking the look of this 54” blade hanging on the front! With a tractor that stars now and a big blade hanging on the front it seemed like the right time to go for a ride. I drove up the hill behind the house. The tractor seemed to handle the incline well, but it seemed to me the hydraulic motor was winning. The oil tank is low so I’m gonna try a fluid change and fill to the right level and see if it makes a difference. As I drove back down the hill and the tractor began to free wheel it became apparent to me that nothing at that auction had brakes! I guess I’ll have to come up with a band.
I just putted around the shop after that. The carry all is handy. There is still plenty to do but I think I made some good progress tonight.

These tractors look great with a blade in front, right? For the longest time I wanted a blade and couldn't find one then all of a sudden I have three. A pleasure to push some dirt!

That is a handy box!

I like the box on the back.
You'll have to get use to using the retard position on the travel lever. It works best at higher RPM.
Try wiggling the travel lever a little when it won't it won't crank. Might be the neutral safety switch.

Timj wrote: ↑Wed Sep 07, 2022 10:13 pm I like the box on the back.
You'll have to get use to using the retard position on the travel lever. It works best at higher RPM.
Try wiggling the travel lever a little when it won't it won't crank. Might be the neutral safety switch.

I didn’t even think about the safety switch. I’ll have to have a look at it.

JSinMO wrote: ↑Wed Sep 07, 2022 10:47 pm

Timj wrote: ↑Wed Sep 07, 2022 10:13 pm I like the box on the back.
You'll have to get use to using the retard position on the travel lever. It works best at higher RPM.
Try wiggling the travel lever a little when it won't it won't crank. Might be the neutral safety switch.

I didn’t even think about the safety switch. I’ll have to have a look at it.

The neutral safety switch can build up a little corrosion from not being used . If not worn to bad a quick clean is all they need .

I needed to move the tractor out of the way for another project today. Son wanted to be the test pilot. He drove around for a little while learning the controls. We changed the engine and hydraulic oils too. This is the reaction I was hoping for! He says he wants to do the snow plowing this winter!

@thebuildist I looked back through your thread on building your loader and counter weight. You’ve given me inspiration to do something similar for this tractor for traction when plowing. I also want to build a receiver to fit the sleeve adapter to attach a hitch to move the trailer and maybe some implements for the other tractors. I think it would handy. Hopefully I’ll get some time to try a little fabrication!

Awesome!@JSinMO the smile says it all. Good way to start into running tractors, just the right size.
A little weight on the back and chains and you will have a nice snow moving machine.

Indeed, your son will have fun with this machine!

Awesome! Like Tim says, smile says it all. Remember driving our 155 when I was his age

Wheel weights (and if possible chains) make a huge difference pushing snow.

Here's a quick video I took pushing snow last winter.

https://youtube.com/shorts/dDx7URhUnYk?feature=share



Sent from my Pixel 4a using Tapatalk

Chad wrote: ↑Mon Sep 12, 2022 1:28 pm Awesome! Like Tim says, smile says it all. Remember driving our 155 when I was his age

Wheel weights (and if possible chains) make a huge difference pushing snow.

Here's a quick video I took pushing snow last winter.

https://youtube.com/shorts/dDx7URhUnYk?feature=share



Sent from my Pixel 4a using Tapatalk

Great clip Chad! I love the sound of that Kohler!!! Yay, let the snow come, I want to throw some snow around!!! don't shoot me

Eugen wrote: ↑Mon Sep 12, 2022 1:50 pm

Chad wrote: ↑Mon Sep 12, 2022 1:28 pm Awesome! Like Tim says, smile says it all. Remember driving our 155 when I was his age

Wheel weights (and if possible chains) make a huge difference pushing snow.

Here's a quick video I took pushing snow last winter.

https://youtube.com/shorts/dDx7URhUnYk?feature=share



Sent from my Pixel 4a using Tapatalk

Great clip Chad! I love the sound of that Kohler!!! Yay, let the snow come, I want to throw some snow around!!! don't shoot me

Not yet , not ready yet .

Thanks for the video @Chad !

I have to agree with Dave, not ready for winter.
You guys can keep it up north as long as you like, in fact you can keep it all together! Just send down 1 or 2 snows for us to plow.

JSinMO wrote: ↑Sun Sep 11, 2022 8:37 pm I needed to move the tractor out of the way for another project today. Son wanted to be the test pilot. He drove around for a little while learning the controls. We changed the engine and hydraulic oils too. A131017F-4EDC-4611-B1DC-364953528841.jpeg
21DB2001-DC68-4DC5-821F-0CEAD2BD44C5.jpeg

This is the reaction I was hoping for!
FD8059C1-AFA7-43A7-8EB4-BC99526BEC26.jpeg

He says he wants to do the snow plowing this winter!

@thebuildist I looked back through your thread on building your loader and counter weight. You’ve given me inspiration to do something similar for this tractor for traction when plowing. I also want to build a receiver to fit the sleeve adapter to attach a hitch to move the trailer and maybe some implements for the other tractors. I think it would handy. Hopefully I’ll get some time to try a little fabrication!

We all can't wait to see what you come up with!

Bob

It seems to me that the big wheel tractors are all a little lite in the rear end. Unless you have fairly level ground and just mow and do lite duty stuff with them. I've had the wheel weights on my 4118 since new and can definitely tell the difference with the 448 with out them.

@JSinMO I can see you using your tractor for serious work and it's not exactly level by you. I would look at some for your tractor, not crazy heavy but some. You can put more on the 3pt when needed. The advantage of wheel weights is they put the weight directly to the ground and don't put it on the tractor components.

Finding OEM by you is probably not a good option, D-10s usually go for a hundy each and the plastic covered don't seem to come up often and are usually beatup. Older JD combine weights and a couple others work. Loading tires is also an option. So is making your own.
Just some thoughts (ramble), I have to do something on the 448 before winter too.

@JSinMO about the hitch ball receiver. The sleeve hitch has two threaded holes on its face, so that you can move the hitch plate from the tractor body to the sleeve hitch, then the ball could be installed on that plate. I guess if you want to get fancy, you could attach an actual receiver on the sleeve hitch somehow. I guess it depends how easy it is to get it off, and often you think you might need the sleeve hitch for something else.

I'm with Tim on the weight, if you can, put as much weight on the wheels, before adding weight to the rear frame. I scored two 162 lbs JD combine wheel weights which fit perfectly our wheels. I doubt you'll ever need more than that for just snow pushing. For reference the JD combine weights are part numbers H78062 and H93849. I drove one hour one way to a combine junk yard to get mine and could not be happier. However, Dave build wheel weights out of concrete, much cheaper, and they work just as well. He and Bob also filled their tires with liquid. Lots of ideas here. The most important factor here is that weight is really important for traction.

Thanks guys. That’s a really good point about keeping weight off the frame. I’ll have to look around for options for wheel weight.

One thing I’m also thinking about doing is separating the 3point function from the main tractor hydraulics. I’m not liking the 3point moving when I lift or lower the blade.
Looks like there is just a T on the valve under the tractor. I could cap that off. Since I have the PTO valve on the back I can plumb the 3point to that. That would give me independent function. I guess I would loose the ability to float the 3point, but I don’t really have a need to at this point.

What I know for sure right now is I have more ideas than time to try them!

JSinMO wrote: ↑Tue Sep 13, 2022 8:16 pm Thanks guys. That’s a really good point about keeping weight off the frame. I’ll have to look around for options for wheel weight.

One thing I’m also thinking about doing is separating the 3point function from the main tractor hydraulics. I’m not liking the 3point moving when I lift or lower the blade.
Looks like there is just a T on the valve under the tractor. I could cap that off. Since I have the PTO valve on the back I can plumb the 3point to that. That would give me independent function. CD2D76E1-01E4-4029-A093-7CE4D2147E0E.jpeg

I guess I would loose the ability to float the 3point, but I don’t really have a need to at this point.

What I know for sure right now is I have more ideas than time to try them!

You won't like running the 3pt and probably shouldn't off the PTO. The PTO valve is full flow and pressure of tractors hydraulic system. Dead heading the pump would happen easily. The lift cylinder isn't designed for high pressure.

How you use your tractor will play into what you do. There's a few options. I've tolerated the simultaneous up down for many years, didn't like it, but didn't have the 3pt on for many years either.

1. Selector valve, let's you select what you want. I used the need to replace hoses for the time to install the valve. I'll do a cost break down someday.
2. You could put a single hydraulic shut off valve in the line to the circuit you don't want to move.
3. Some have used a "snubber" set-up, it's like metal washers and rubber discs you put on the ram to restrict it's movement. I'll find a pic. Think it through, I thought I had mine figured out, now I'm rethinking my valve placement on the 448.

Generally folks install a 3 way selector valve in either of the lift lines. In one position the oil is routed to the deck lift and not the three point. In the other position the three point gets oil and the deck doesn't .

Each cylinder has two hoses. You only need to divert one set of them. I installed my selector valve in the "lift up" hose leading to both cylinders. Think of it as replacing the tee with a 3 way ball valve.

When a cylinder is selected, it has a working pair of hoses connecting it to the tcv, and a cylinder can only move when it has a complete circuit/path for the fluid to flow, one hose "out"and the other hose "back".

When a cylinder is"non -selected", one of its hoses is still connected by tee to the tcv, and will this be subjected to whatever pressure or suction, but since it's other hose is being sealed off by the selector valve, that cylinder can't/won't move.

Bob

Very good information guys. Thank you again. When I think of my immediate use of the tractor a simple shutoff valve to the 3point would work. I want it to hold position when using the blade or a mower deck. Of course the need may change over time, I see this tractor serving a general utility role for us at this point. I need to go up to the technical data and do some homework. Thanks again guys, I really appreciate your knowledge!

Here is what I came up with for a easily removable ball for my sleeve hitch.

Gordy

Gordy wrote: ↑Wed Sep 14, 2022 10:14 am Here is what I came up with for a easily removable ball for my sleeve hitch.

image.png


Gordy

That’s pretty much what I had in mind. After digging around in my pieces and parts I came up with some galvanized C channel, and a hitch. I need to make a receiver for it and try welding it all together!

Here’s what I came up with for a hitch. A sloppy paint job, and a sneaky camera angle, and you can hardly see how terrible my welding is! I guess the proof is in using it. I went around picking things up and moving them. So far my welds didn’t break! This did show me that I absolutely need to come up with weight and chains, or ag tires. The turf tires with no weight sure like to spin.

I'm sure it's much better than my welds

Looks good too, @JSinMO

Yeah, you need more weight, that's for sure!

No fixing tonight, but some fun learning. I had a low hanging decent sized limb hanging over the driveway that I cut off. I asked son if he wanted drag it off with the 446. He jumped up like he was sitting on springs!
Everybody likes to brag on their kids, but I must say I’m really happy at how well he is doing at operating.
I think I made the right move bringing this one home.

Creating memories are very special times.

Keep the Peace
Harry

@JSinMO so nice to see the young ones enjoying something REAL! This is the best type of investment!

JSinMO wrote: ↑Tue Sep 20, 2022 9:31 pm No fixing tonight, but some fun learning. I had a low hanging decent sized limb hanging over the driveway that I cut off. I asked son if he wanted drag it off with the 446. He jumped up like he was sitting on springs!

F630F7DB-53AE-4727-B52B-C916A21BC89E.jpegE5804EBB-CA35-4EA6-BD1A-996A8D999A86.jpegF692B34A-9EA5-48B0-A35F-150BFD58283E.jpeg

Everybody likes to brag on their kids, but I must say I’m really happy at how well he is doing at operating.
I think I made the right move bringing this one home.

Of COURSE you made the right move bringing him home. What ELSE were you going to do with him? He's your SON.

Sheesh. SO callous....

@thebuildist

@thebuildist Your right, it is callous, but it’s a harsh world!

I had a load of rock delivered and used the tractor to blade it down. I probably should not work it too much before I check the rear end, but I went ahead and ran it for about an hour. Even with no weight it performed well. I had the oil topped off to the line on the dipstick when I started I checked again once the engine was cold and I do have some oil consumption. I don’t think it’s anything to worry about but now I know I need to keep an eye on it. The only other issue I found is that the hydraulics creep down, makes it hard to set the blade where you want it. I do have a small leak at the valve so I need to check that and see if it helps. I didn’t get any work pictures but here is one after I was done.

A little oil consumption is not too concerning. Would be curious what the compression is like on this engine.

If it's hard to keep the blade in a position I doubt it's from a leak to outside. More likely it's an internal leak in the valve or cylinder.

The cylinder has simple o-ring seals. Not sure what you can do if it's badly scored on the inside. Here's one that broke on one of my tractors while plowing the garden.

Eugen wrote: ↑Thu Sep 29, 2022 11:17 pm A little oil consumption is not too concerning. Would be curious what the compression is like on this engine.

If it's hard to keep the blade in a position I doubt it's from a leak to outside. More likely it's an internal leak in the valve or cylinder.

The cylinder has simple o-ring seals. Not sure what you can do if it's badly scored on the inside. Here's one that broke on one of my tractors while plowing the garden.


E787B2DE-D8E2-4BB3-B719-F045A790B8D5.jpeg

I don’t have a compression test set, but the unscientific thumb over the spark plug hole test, plus the fact it starts right up, and can work under load with no issues tells me it’s still got life in it. But yes it would be interesting to get an actual reading on the cylinders, then again it may just give me something else to worry about! Maybe I’m better off not knowing!

My first thought on the hydraulic issue is it’s at the valve. I can juggle the control lever and get the blade to hold position. It’s annoying but I can deal with it for know.

We’ll see if I still feel that way when I start moving snow!

I don’t know if I’ve ever seen a cylinder break like that. Do you know what happened?

@JSinMO Before you condemn that Onan to having oil usage . Make sure it has the right oil in it . OEM is SAE 30 , but I have found 15w40 Diesel oil to work better and have little usage . All Onan will use some but not enough to worry about if changed regularly.

I'm with Dave on the oil and will add that I noticed some serious difference in different oils when it comes to oil consumption with my Onan's.
I've always ran Havoline 10-30 or 10-40 in my p218 & p216 with little to no oil consumption. I always heard that Onan's always used oil, so I considered myself lucky. 2 years ago I ran some Havoline 10-30 synthetic blend in the p218 sucked oil, was adding everytime time I mowed (3-4 hrs). Thought well, 1200 hrs??. Put 10-30 Rotella in and consumption dropped. Ran 5-30 Valvoline full synthetic for winter last year and into summer and consumption was minimal.
My B48 is to new to me to know, but I've only had to add a little a couple of times this summer and it's been getting a workout. I put 10-30 Rotella in it.
I'm not promoting any brand or type, that might open up a huge debate. This is just my recent experience. Will definitely be trying 15-40 for next summer. (I got 20 gallons out of my bulk tank when I cleaned out my shop).
What I run for this winter is going to depend on if I get the oil heaters put in before winter. Another thing on the list.

Ramble ramble

I put SAE 30 in it when i changed oil. I figured I’d use that since I’m planning to use it on the winter. After the little bit of work we have done with it so far I think the engine is relatively healthy. I may switch to the 15-40 next summer and see how it does. As long as it’s running good I don’t mind tipping it off.

Make sure when going to 15w40 that it is for Diesels . I am not sure what additives are different from reg 15w40 to the diesel 15w40 , but My Onana are much Happier on the diesel formula . I think it makes them fell big and strong .

I admit that for me, when I just get a tractor,the compression test is more for my curiosity than anything else. You didn't say anything about the exhaust fumes, colour, smell. Another thing you might want to have a look at are the spark plugs. Of course, if it works it works, not necessary to dig into any of this.

Eugen wrote: ↑Sat Oct 01, 2022 4:06 pm I admit that for me, when I just get a tractor,the compression test is more for my curiosity than anything else. You didn't say anything about the exhaust fumes, colour, smell. Another thing you might want to have a look at are the spark plugs. Of course, if it works it works, not necessary to dig into any of this.

I checked the spark plugs when I got the tractor going. That looked pretty normal. To your point I should probably check them now that we have been running the tractor. Exhaust smelled normal to me. What I did notice is a puff of blue smoke when I got the tractor under a good load. But like you said if it works it works! I also don’t know how long the tractor had been sitting before we brought it home. The old guys back home used to say, “when you bring a new to you old tractor home, hook a mower to it and run it in the horse weeds till snot runs out of it! Then you’ll know what you have.” To that point some work may be good for it. For now the plan is to use it as is and maintain it.

JSinMO wrote: ↑Fri Sep 30, 2022 9:20 pm

I don’t know if I’ve ever seen a cylinder break like that. Do you know what happened?

The outer sleeve of the cylinder is about 1/8" thick and it has two holes at one end, through which the pin goes. The pin just ripped through the cylinder sleeve. It's not meant for high forces or a lot of weight on the sleeve hitch. Mine broke as I kept pulling the plow out of the ground when it went too deep.

Eugen wrote: ↑Wed Oct 05, 2022 12:54 pm

JSinMO wrote: ↑Fri Sep 30, 2022 9:20 pm

I don’t know if I’ve ever seen a cylinder break like that. Do you know what happened?

The outer sleeve of the cylinder is about 1/8" thick and it has two holes at one end, through which the pin goes. The pin just ripped through the cylinder sleeve. It's not meant for high forces or a lot of weight on the sleeve hitch. Mine broke as I kept pulling the plow out of the ground when it went too deep.

Well lesson learned. At least you found the weak point in the system. Makes me think maybe it was already weak.

JSinMO wrote: ↑Wed Oct 05, 2022 8:52 pm

Eugen wrote: ↑Wed Oct 05, 2022 12:54 pm

JSinMO wrote: ↑Fri Sep 30, 2022 9:20 pm

I don’t know if I’ve ever seen a cylinder break like that. Do you know what happened?

The outer sleeve of the cylinder is about 1/8" thick and it has two holes at one end, through which the pin goes. The pin just ripped through the cylinder sleeve. It's not meant for high forces or a lot of weight on the sleeve hitch. Mine broke as I kept pulling the plow out of the ground when it went too deep.

Well lesson learned. At least you found the weak point in the system. Makes me think maybe it was already weak.

Mine on the 3pt. did the same thing a little after I got it working . The unknown to me PO had "adjusted " the releaf valve as it was full locked down .

I tinkered around on the 446 this afternoon. I mentioned before that the blade didn’t like to hold position so I had a look underneath. I found some loose fitting and I adjusted the linkage. It didn’t help, but I think it stopped the leaks I had. So I think I confirmed the thoughts you guys had on this. Its bypassing internally either at the valve or cylinder. I did find that if I lowered the blade slowly it would hold fine, or if I jiggled the control it would hold. At this point I’m not thinking of tearing into it. I think we’ll run it and see how it goes.

We will be blading our driveway this winter and I really don’t want to be digging into the rock, so I’m going to make some shoes for the blade to ride on. The blade does have adjustable feet but I don’t think they will work well in rock. Digging around the empire of dirt I found a couple of pieces of steel I’m gonna try. On a side not that little plasma cutter I bought works great. Even plugged into house current at 15 amps. So this is what I’m thinking of making. I’ll weld some straps vertically to the shoes and use the bolt hole on the blade to bolt them on.
The hope is they will ride on the rock and keep the blade from digging in. We’ll see how it goes.

It'll be interesting to see how well it works. I don't see why it shouldn't. What do you call rock? Gravel? Here most people without a paved driveway use gravel. I got gravel too. I would not use the snowcaster until the ground is well frozen and I can let it float. Some people put a piece of pipe on the cutting edge..

I don't know if anybody here has done it but have seen where others have split a piece of 1 1/4" schedule 80 PVC pipe the long way and slid it over the cutting edge to save on digging into the gravel. Some have done metal pipe.

@Eugen Yes it’s gravel. I recently had a load spread on the driveway, I’d hate to push half of it into a snow pile.

I thought about a pipe one the cutting edge like you and @Timj said. I see there is a least 1 company out there that makes a “shoe” to fit a loader bucket to keep it from digging in. Since I had these pieces of steel I’d thought I’d try it. Of course it will be much less refined, but it should work the same. If it doesn’t work I’ll stick a piece of pipe on it!

I put my skid shoes down quite a bit. That seems to help. Most of my trouble is when the ground is not froze. Like at this time of year and spring when things are thawing out. I use rock dust on our drive ways. Think some call it pea gravel. It’s nice and small. Packs hard. Is smooth. Doesn’t hurt the snow thrower or mowing deck as much as that 3/4 driveway gravel. And both are the same price.

There now, a gravel ramble. Hehe.

Noel

Propane57 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 07, 2022 10:56 am I put my skid shoes down quite a bit. That seems to help. Most of my trouble is when the ground is not froze. Like at this time of year and spring when things are thawing out. I use rock dust on our drive ways. Think some call it pea gravel. It’s nice and small. Packs hard. Is smooth. Doesn’t hurt the snow thrower or mowing deck as much as that 3/4 driveway gravel. And both are the same price.

There now, a gravel ramble. Hehe.

Noel

I have the same trouble all winter with freeze and thaw cycles. Never know what you’ll get here. Some winter are bitter, some are mild, some are both!

Today I was going to bring the tractor back into the shop. Went to get it turned the key and it wouldn’t start! Choke, no choke, more throttle, less throttle didn’t matter. It would just sputter and die. The temperature was around 32F and the thought jumped into my head, “ this isn’t going to be one that doesn’t like to start in the winter is it?”
I fiddled around with it a little more then another thought came to me, “Life is hard, but it’s a lot harder if you’re stupid”. You know, as great as these Case tractors are they just refuse to run without fuel! Yup, a little gas in the tank and it fires right up!

So back to the plan. Todays goal was to check the rear end and work on snow skies for the blade.
Tear down went easy and I think it’s safe to say nobody has been in here for a long time. It’s always a fingers crossed moment when I open something like this up! Hey it looks good! Bolts are tight, no broken teeth, everything moved well, no water in the oil. So it was a drain, clean out the gunk in the bottom, and refill.
I probably didn’t need to open that up, but if I hadn’t it would alway be in the back of my mind wondering if it was good to go, or ready to break.

With the back end reassembled, time to move on to the blade. Here’s what I came up with to keep the blade from digging into my gravel. I realize it’s poorly make with crappy welds, but I say it’s FUBAR. Which of course means Formed Using the Best Available Resources! In other words I made them with junk I had laying around.
I drove around with the blade down for a bit and it seems to work fine. Didn’t pick up any gravel. We’ll see how it does when we’re actually pushing snow!
If it doesn’t work well, then I’ll take them off and put a piece of pipe on it!

When working with old tractors it's normal to think of all kind of problems if it doesn't start, but it also never hurts to check if there's enough gas.


Good idea to get that transmission open. Now you know for sure it's good. It haven't done this yet on any of my tractors, but it's crossed my mind. I'm curious, are you reusing the gasket for the cover? This was a concern for me, as it can be a way for the water to get in.

About the blade shoes, I'm thinking that if you haven't picked gravel now I don't see a reason for it to happen when it snows. But one thing, how does it work if you angle the blade?

As I started reading the first paragraph, I was thinking it might be out of gas. Don’t worry, I’ve done it too Jeff. Nice fix on the plow. But as Eugen mentioned about angling the blade, you might want to use round disks on there when angling the blade. But maybe you don’t angle the blade when plowing snow.

Noel

This is what we use on the MF 14 plow tractor to keep the blade up of the ground a bit Jeff. They are for snow plows, plow skid shoes. So being round you can angle the blade what ever way you want and they work. Right now they are in non winter duty. We well put them in the other way for snow duty.

Noel

Eugen wrote: ↑Sat Nov 19, 2022 11:47 pm When working with old tractors it's normal to think of all kind of problems if it doesn't start, but it also never hurts to check if there's enough gas.


Good idea to get that transmission open. Now you know for sure it's good. It haven't done this yet on any of my tractors, but it's crossed my mind. I'm curious, are you reusing the gasket for the cover? This was a concern for me, as it can be a way for the water to get in.

About the blade shoes, I'm thinking that if you haven't picked gravel now I don't see a reason for it to happen when it snows. But one thing, how does it work if you angle the blade?

Your right it’s just funny that my mind went right to problems instead of check the gas!


On the transmission cover, since it’s not sealing pressure in, just keeping water out, I don’t get to worried about it. I will reuse them depending on condition. The gasket on the 648 was shot so I pitched and went with gasket maker. On this 446 the gasket looked great not broken or crumbly so it got cleaned up and reused.

I don’t know what the blade will do when angled. Let’s find out! Well it works pretty good with the blade straight, but as you and Noel pointed out, it’s not so happy at an angle.
I saw a similar setup elsewhere and thought I’d try it. I’m calling it a partial success.
@Propane57 the blade came with round feet but I think there smaller than the one you have. They tent to not float but dig into the gravel. Maybe if they had bigger pads?
I have a piece of PVC I might try that over the cutting edge instead

I honestly don't know if one plows snow with an angled blade, as I never used my blade. So maybe if you plow snow straight you'd be fine. But how about this. What if you weld/bolt the skis to the part of the plow that doesn't angle, the body of the plow?

As for the round shoes, I think it's just the size that matter most, so it floats instead of digging in.

I’ll be waiting to hear and see how the pvc pipe works on there Jeff. And your right. The disks should be bigger to work better.


Noel

A lot of guys on the old forum ran and liked the PVC pipe, schedule 80 was preferred. I guess as long as you don't hit something really hard it holds up well. For heavy wet snow nothing's going to work well. The pipe may just ride up and pack it down.
My driveway is pretty hard and once it's frozen it usually stays frozen. Also these blades are pretty light compared to a truck plow. I only run the blade for light snow, usually run the blower. The only time I run full angle is on the long parts of the driveway. The rest of the time I just bulldoze. Was actually thinking of making some swept forward wings to carry more snow and make blade about 6'.

A fella I chat with on another site made a snow pusher for his tractor last year. So this year he took the pusher off and put a plow on that angles. He’s tried it out and all ready has taken the plow off and put the pusher back on.


Noel

Propane57 wrote: ↑Sun Nov 20, 2022 5:00 pm A fella I chat with on another site made a snow pusher for his tractor last year. So this year he took the pusher off and put a plow on that angles. He’s tried it out and all ready has taken the plow off and put the pusher back on.


Noel

I ran a set of these on a 8' straight blade the last four years I plowed. Rarely took them off, wished I would have gotten them 25 years sooner.
https://m.northerntool.com/shop/tools/p ... 7800_17800

I looked around the shop and found this piece of 2” I think I’ll try Part of the problem here is even though we see temps below zero sometimes it generally doesn’t last long. We are much more likely to see temperature above freezing during the day and freezing at night. The top layer of ground is in a constant freeze thaw cycle so the driveway never really freezes up. Sometimes on small snows I don’t even bother since I know it will be melted off in a couple of days.

I’m not sure how I’ll blade the drive way off. With the big tractor I ran the blade at an angle. But with this I’m not sure which way I’ll like better. Just have to play with it and see. I want to end up with a set up that is as close to just jumping on the tractor and going as I can get so son can run it without a lot of adjustment.

Anyway I’ll update when I put the pipe on. That will have to be another day as today turned into wrestling with 40 year old tires that are hard as a brick! This one is full of ice! So much fun I can hardly stand it!

Glad your having fun Jeff.

Noel

Propane57 wrote: ↑Sun Nov 20, 2022 5:00 pm A fella I chat with on another site made a snow pusher for his tractor last year. So this year he took the pusher off and put a plow on that angles. He’s tried it out and all ready has taken the plow off and put the pusher back on.


Noel

Noel, what is a snow pusher? Or how is it different than the plow?

JSinMO wrote: ↑Sun Nov 20, 2022 7:53 pm
I’m not sure how I’ll blade the drive way off. With the big tractor I ran the blade at an angle. But with this I’m not sure which way I’ll like better. Just have to play with it and see. I want to end up with a set up that is as close to just jumping on the tractor and going as I can get so son can run it without a lot of adjustment.

If you think it worked fine with the big tractor it should work well with the 446 too. In any case, I don't think there's a setup that works ideal when you have gravel. I know that when you grade a gravel driveway the least trouble is the rear blade. Maybe this should be a clue of what works best with snow on gravel. I had plans to make a rear blade for a long time, and just never got around to do it.

The way I see it, what you want is something that sinks to the bottom of the snow, but not into the gravel. Since you're not dealing with a lot of snow you'd be fine pushing the blade straight with the shoes you made. I'd try that first and not worry about the pipe for now.

I have gravel and am using the snow caster. No matter what I do, every so often the caster will dig in and gravel will fly I suppose it doesn't bother me that much as to put a pipe on it.

Just little ramble Jeff..

Our driveway is gravel and needs a lot of maintenance in fall and spring. Although a rear 3pt blade is "Ok" control amd traction on the hill are an issue. This is the preferred tool, made from a Massey front blade, Roper transaxle, scrap metal and 3 cat 0 3rd links. The 3rd links are used to set up crowning and depth control.

Eugen wrote: ↑Mon Nov 21, 2022 9:45 am

Propane57 wrote: ↑Sun Nov 20, 2022 5:00 pm A fella I chat with on another site made a snow pusher for his tractor last year. So this year he took the pusher off and put a plow on that angles. He’s tried it out and all ready has taken the plow off and put the pusher back on.


Noel

Noel, what is a snow pusher? Or how is it different than the plow?

As you can see it is basically a blade with sides on it to hold more snow before the snow rolls off the sides. I have also seen these made with huge heavy equipment tires cut in half to form a semicircle, with the bead and part of the side walls removed to form a kind of cutting edge.


Gordy

Gordy wrote: ↑Mon Nov 21, 2022 10:17 am

As you can see it is basically a blade with sides on it to hold more snow before the snow rolls off the sides. I have also seen these made with huge heavy equipment tires cut in half to form a semicircle, with the bead and part of the side walls removed to form a kind of cutting edge.


Gordy

Thanks Gordy, I've seen these in paved parking lots of big stores. I suppose you put it on float and go go go


@Spike188 I have always admired your grader, a really nice device you made there!

Spike188 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 21, 2022 10:16 am Our driveway is gravel and needs a lot of maintenance in fall and spring. image.pngAlthough a rear 3pt blade is "Ok" control amd traction on the hill are an issue.image.png This is the preferred tool, made from a Massey front blade, Roper transaxle, scrap metal and 3 cat 0 3rd links. The 3rd links are used to set up crowning and depth control.

Neat tool Spike, just like a road grader.


Noel

Gordy wrote: ↑Mon Nov 21, 2022 10:17 am

Eugen wrote: ↑Mon Nov 21, 2022 9:45 am

Propane57 wrote: ↑Sun Nov 20, 2022 5:00 pm A fella I chat with on another site made a snow pusher for his tractor last year. So this year he took the pusher off and put a plow on that angles. He’s tried it out and all ready has taken the plow off and put the pusher back on.


Noel

Noel, what is a snow pusher? Or how is it different than the plow?

image.png

As you can see it is basically a blade with sides on it to hold more snow before the snow rolls off the sides. I have also seen these made with huge heavy equipment tires cut in half to form a semicircle, with the bead and part of the side walls removed to form a kind of cutting edge.


Gordy

Yep. That’s the one Eugen. A person could make any size they wanted.

Noel

@Eugen good ramble! And some good points. You’re probably right about using the shoes I made. The problem is now I’m really curious about how the pipe idea would work! I will probably make it up and see what it does.

@Spike188 that pull type blade is nicely done! Really cool. If you happen to have some pictures of it in use I’d love to see them!

JSinMO wrote: ↑Mon Nov 21, 2022 11:31 pm @Eugen good ramble! And some good points. You’re probably right about using the shoes I made. The problem is now I’m really curious about how the pipe idea would work! I will probably make it up and see what it does.

@Spike188 that pull type blade is nicely done! Really cool. If you happen to have some pictures of it in use I’d love to see them!

@JSinMO here's a little of what you're looking for. This thing is awesome,
viewtopic.php?t=110

Thanks @Timj looks like it works great!

Using a Blade.
My driveway is short and as wide as my two car garage. I use a blower. My parents driveway, which I've cleared for the last five years is 1000' long and skinny. I found the blade at full angle on my 444 worked great. Originally, I used low range and was disappointed; even with the plow angled, the snow would build up in front and slide off both sides. I was leaving streamers down the cleared side. In frustration, I put it in high gear, and full rev. It was like a new machine; the snow was not only all going to the angled side, but I was even throwing it a little. Now I want more speed.

I decided to continue my testing setting up the blade for snow use. I took the length of 2” schedule 40 PVC I had and cut a slit in it with my circular saw. I left a 1” overhang on each end of the blade thinking I may have to put some clamps there to hold the pipe in place, but I doubt it’s necessary. It fit tight over the cutting edge. I went out and tested it in the drive way and was really surprised at the results. It really didn’t matter if the blade was straight or angled, or if I set the blade to float or not it really dug into the gravel. The shoes I made performed better, at least with the blade set straight.

I know a lot of people have had success using this setup so I’m thinking I need to try it again once we actually have snow on the ground as it will probably ride over the gravel better. I was also thinking I could modify the shoes I made to have a wider stance, something like Noel has on his blade.
So I guess the testing will reconvene when the snow falls!

@JSinMO I think your biggest problem is your gravel is still loose and does not have any fines in there from what I can see that will allow for compaction . If you can get some snow compacted in the stone then it will work better for you .

On my gravel driveway that goes to my shop, I drive over it a few times to pack the snow down. Then let it freeze and any future snow on there comes off really good with no digging into the gravel.

Keep the
Harry

DavidBarkey wrote: ↑Sun Nov 27, 2022 4:50 pm @JSinMO I think your biggest problem is your gravel is still loose and does not have any fines in there from what I can see that will allow for compaction . If you can get some snow compacted in the stone then it will work better for you .

I agree Around here that would be called a rock driveway. Gravel here is called Class-5 (C-5), and is a mix of rock and fines, the C-5 means it has 5% clay mixed in to act as a binder, which when dry or damp sets up like concrete with just a few loose rocks on top.


Gordy

My stone driveway is actually #1 crush and run, at least that's what the driver who delivered it and spread it for me called it. It actually is not like concrete but stones that vary in size.
Keep the
Harry

You guys are right about my driveway I just had this delivered recently. It is rock with little to know fines in it. The pictures are of the level spot in front of my shop. The rest of the driveway runs down hill to the road. Last time I had 2 loads spread with a lot of fines, more of a gravel. It did pack good, but any decent rain would wash it out. Our driveway looked like a creek bed. Easy enough to fix but over time all the fines washed away and didn’t leave much rock. This time I went with more of a stone. We’ll see how it reacts to the big rains. The problem is the drive way is bowl shaped, exactly what you don’t want going downhill! It would take quite a bit of fill to change it so I live with it.

I’m thinking the idea of packing some snow in the rock will make the difference. We’ll see!

That’s big looking rock Jeff. Hard to do anything with that. Ya wouldn’t want to get that into a snowblower. Or a mowing deck while cutting the grass on the edge of the driveway. Snowpack is the answer I’d say.
What about a set of 6” or so caster wheels mounted behind the plow, if there’s room, and have them adjustable for height. They would work while the plow is angled too maybe.


Noel

This is what the parts of my unpaved that has the rock dust or what ever it’s called in your area. Where my ranger is sitting was all grass years ago. Son and I took up the sod and and put this rock dust down. This would be 15 years ago. It has never moved. Never get ruts in it.

Noel

Rock dust / crusher run is a range in sizes material that with flat side and different sizes/ shapes "lock" together when compacted and stays that way . Stone with rounded side "marble " and do not lock together , which is great under foot but makes a lousy driveway in winter . So I found out the hardway

Propane57 wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 3:23 pm This is what the parts of my unpaved that has the rock dust or what ever it’s called in your area. Where my ranger is sitting was all grass years ago. Son and I took up the sod and and put this rock dust down. This would be 15 years ago. It has never moved. Never get ruts in it.

Noel

I’d say It still looks great after 15 years!

Must have taken quite awhile to haul it in with that dump-truck in the picture!

One load at a time Jeff. One load at a time. Hehe.

This massive dump truck was a project over been doing on and off for the last two weeks. A Christmas gift for my grandson and his father. The father has dump trucks and are that colour. But with out the decal. So I fixed up this rusty toy for them. Fathers name is Jordan. And grandsons name is Hudson. So that’s where the decal idea came from. A tractor buddie of mine in South Dakota does small decal things for a hobbie. He was into that business years ago. So thats where the decal came from.
Was fun to do.


Noel

Sorry to be off the topic. Just a few more pictures.
I’m trilled how it turned out.

Noel

Propane57 wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 7:48 pm One load at a time Jeff. One load at a time. Hehe.

Noel

No problem being a little off topic Noel.
I’m glad you posted that. You did a great job! Excellent save of an old toy. That will be a great Christmas present.
Well done!

JSinMO wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 8:12 pm

Propane57 wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 7:48 pm One load at a time Jeff. One load at a time. Hehe.

Noel

No problem being a little off topic Noel.
I’m glad you posted that. You did a great job! Excellent save of an old toy. That will be a great Christmas present.
Well done!

Agreed, neat idea, nice job!

Truck looks good Noel. I like how you didn't polish the windshield back to clear

Thats awesome little truck Noel . Now the little man will need a loader to fill it .

DavidBarkey wrote: ↑Wed Nov 30, 2022 5:53 am Thats awesome little truck Noel . Now the little man will need a loader to fill it .

Noel

Back when I bought the 446 I met a man at the auction that is a fairly serious GT collector. We have stayed in touch since then. I called him this morning and asked if he had a set of tire chains I could buy from him. He said he was short on time today but told me to stop by on my way out of town. I got there and he said “I just picked up these tires and rims with chain’s already on them, take them with you and try them out. If you like them we’ll figure something out later”! Just shows once again that tractor guys are some of the nicest people around!

He apologized for the chains being mis matched, I said beggars can’t be choosers! Can’t see what that would hurt anyway. I’m looking for traction, not beauty!
I’ll have to put them on later and get ready to try them out!

Great score Jeff! Looks like one the of chains has bits welded on like my and Tim's vbar chains. You will like the difference it makes!

Nice Score @JSinMO 4 link ice chains on one and 2 link regualr chains on the other and a set of rims and tire tooo boot .

It’s been awhile since I worked the garden I’m hoping to get everything planted this week if the weather cooperates. I had a lot of grass and weeds growing and I didn’t really want to walk behind the tiller that long so I did this.

This is not the optimal set up but I had to try it! This disc it a little big for the tractor, and I had it set so it would really cut so it was a harder to pull than if it was set straight.

The 446 spend a lot of the time with the front wheels off the ground as we went across the garden. The blade isn’t enough weight up front for this.

I don’t know if you can see in the background, but it was doing a pretty good job. Then it happened. All at once it stated dumping copious amounts of smoke and oil! The engine sounded fine but I shut it down fast just in case.

I tried to get pictures but I’m not sure you can see what’s happening. The only thing I could see so far is the rubber hose from the crankcase tube is shot and was just hanging there.
I unhooked the disc and started the tractor back up. It fired right up and sounded fine so I drove it back up to the shop.
I was working it pretty hard, but I don’t think I did any real damage. Im thinking I’ll replace the bad hose and see what happens!

Just as you were having some fun eh? I had oil coming from that hose on my 226 once. The hose was in bad shape so I replaced it, and the dip stick was not air tight so I fixed it, then all was fine.

Hope it's something simple Jeff!

BTW I saw someone in the Case group on Facebook selling a Case tiller for 250 in South Haven MI. I know it's far from you but I also noticed that shipping in your country is way cheaper than here.

Well the 446 has developed an issue. I used it to gather hay bales yesterday and it ran great, not so much as a sputter. Today on the other hand, I started it up and went to move it and it died. Upon initial start up it throttled up fine but now it will just idle, if you try to give it more throttle it will immediately die.

I didn’t have much time today but I did take a quick look. Here what I know.
I have spark.
The fuel pump is working.
I can get it to idle but can’t give it throttle.

I’m thinking my next step is to pull the intake and carb and look for problems or leaks. I’m curious to know what you guys think. Any thoughts are appreciated.

Don’t want say this, but, out of gas ?


Noel

If it starts and idles fine but stumbles/misses as soon as the throttle is increased the condenser has failed.

Bob

Bad ground on the condenser will make it run funny.

Noel

@propane1 @myerslawnandgarden thanks guys.
I does have gas and the fuel pump is pumping. I hadn’t thought about the condenser I’ll have to see if I’ve got one and switch it out.

JSinMO wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2023 5:48 pm @propane1 @myerslawnandgarden thanks guys.
I does have gas and the fuel pump is pumping. I hadn’t thought about the condenser I’ll have to see if I’ve got one and switch it out.

Even if you don't have the correct condenser, you can take anyone that you have and connect it at the negative terminal of the coil and ground it where convenient. That will at least tell you if the condenser is the problem.

Bob

myerslawnandgarden wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2023 9:01 pm

JSinMO wrote: ↑Mon Sep 11, 2023 5:48 pm @propane1 @myerslawnandgarden thanks guys.
I does have gas and the fuel pump is pumping. I hadn’t thought about the condenser I’ll have to see if I’ve got one and switch it out.

Even if you don't have the correct condenser, you can take anyone that you have and connect it at the negative terminal of the coil and ground it where convenient. That will at least tell you if the condenser is the problem.

Bob

I found a new condenser on the shelf,I think it’s for my Farmall Cub. I wired it in and it made no difference. Except now it won’t run at all. I pulled a plug to verify spark and it’s good, but the plug was dry, no gas getting to the cylinder. Since I know the fuel pump works I decided to go ahead and pull the intake and carb.

I think I found the issue!
That’s where I had to stop for now. I’ll have to clean up the intake and reseal it and I guess I might as well go through the carburetor while it’s off. At least now I know what’s going on!

That's some good troubleshooting! Good thing it didn't overheat and bend your heads. A dab of grey gasket maker and you're back in business! Or?

Eugen wrote: ↑Tue Sep 12, 2023 7:31 pm That's some good troubleshooting! Good thing it didn't overheat and bend your heads. A dab of grey gasket maker and you're back in business! Or?

Thank you. I don’t think anything got warped it was running fine when I shut it down. My plan is Permatex grey and then Seal all over that. Noel has me hooked on it!
Seriously though I’m impressed with Seal all enough that i have no problem reaching for it on stuff like this.

Sounds good. Is Seal all ok with the temperature of the intake?

Eugen wrote: ↑Tue Sep 12, 2023 9:35 pm Sounds good. Is Seal all ok with the temperature of the intake?

Good question. Now that you bring it up this may get too hot. Hadn’t thought about it, thank you. I’ll have to read on the tube. If so then I’ll just go with the grey and see how it does.

The spec I found for it is 150F. But I don't know if the intake gets so hot. I know permatex grey can do more for sure.

I’ve used Seal All on the block, of the engine in my MF7, to stop an oil leak. It was put on years ago. Still not leaking.
Maybe I should not of said that.

Noel

propane1 wrote: ↑Wed Sep 13, 2023 2:11 am I’ve used Seal All on the block, of the engine in my MF7, to stop an oil leak. It was put on years ago. Still not leaking.
Maybe I should not of said that.

Noel

Noel, it might make a big difference where on the block is used. Near the head?

My intention was not to say Seal all is not good to be used on the air intake of the Onan engine. I was just wondering about the temperature there, that's all.

No worry’s Eugen. I didn't mean any thing by what I said. I just hope I don’t get a leak there now by what I said.
Ya, so where I put it was down by the drain plug. So not quite as hot there. But you’d not be placing your finger there on the block in that place. It would be hot enough.

Noel

The intake basically fell in two so there sure wasn’t much holding it together. I cleaned up the surfaces and made sure everything would go together easily. I decided to run Permatex grey on it and then go ahead after it cures and put a bead of Seal all over that for insurance. Is it necessary? Probably not but I don’t want to take this apart any time soon! I’d guess the intake probably gets to the upper end of the suggested heat range, but if Noel used it successfully on the lower part of his engine block then I think it will be fine. If nothing else it’ll be another test bed to see how it reacts to heat.
I took a look at the carburetor and thankfully there were no surprises. It actually looks pretty good, passageways we’re all clear. So once all the goo cures I’ll make a couple new gaskets and slap it back together! Hopefully it starts!

The repair should be fine I think. I'm curious, are those rivets or how is it holding together?

Sometimes adhesives and sealants are not compatible with certain materials or each other and it can cause them to not cure properly. If the permatex gray and seal all don't cure properly together, you can always just use the permatex gray.

I know those manifolds are aluminum. Do you think they could be welded? Harry. PS: Eugen we need a welding icon! There was a cool one on the old CCI site with a welder flipping his hood down and then a bright arc. When VS got the site they got rid of the cool icons.

Eugen wrote: ↑Thu Sep 14, 2023 12:24 am The repair should be fine I think. I'm curious, are those rivets or how is it holding together?

No it doesn’t appear this is riveted. The “nubs” you see in the picture look to be alignment pins and are part of the casting. I question why Onan decided on a two piece intake in the first place. My guess is it came down to money and production time. Probably faster and cheaper to make them that way. It looks to me like the only thing that keeps the halves together it whatever sealant they used during assembly. It sounds like a poor idea to make it that way then I realize it’s been 50 years since they put it together at the factory so I’d say it worked pretty well!


@Harry the mating surface is kinda thin. I’m sure it could be welded but it would take someone with considerably more skill than I have.

I’ve got the intake put back together and the plan now is to reassemble the tractor tomorrow night. I guess we’ll see if I glued it up good enough!

JSinMO wrote: ↑Thu Sep 14, 2023 11:12 pm

Eugen wrote: ↑Thu Sep 14, 2023 12:24 am The repair should be fine I think. I'm curious, are those rivets or how is it holding together?

No it doesn’t appear this is riveted. The “nubs” you see in the picture look to be alignment pins and are part of the casting. I question why Onan decided on a two piece intake in the first place. My guess is it came down to money and production time. Probably faster and cheaper to make them that way. It looks to me like the only thing that keeps the halves together it whatever sealant they used during assembly. It sounds like a poor idea to make it that way then I realize it’s been 50 years since they put it together at the factory so I’d say it worked pretty well!


@Harry the mating surface is kinda thin. I’m sure it could be welded but it would take someone with considerably more skill than I have.

I’ve got the intake put back together and the plan now is to reassemble the tractor tomorrow night. I guess we’ll see if I glued it up good enough!

The halves were injected molded .It had more to do with shape and smooth surfaces . Those nubs were to be longer and were peened over to hold the two halves together like rivetting with a little sealent . The peened (rivetted ) part breakes away and the come unglued . I clean them real well carefully drill out both halves and use allum rivets and bolts wrapped in tape to hold together while the JB weld (overnight stuff). cures .

I’m a firm believer in JB Weld. I’ve used it for years with terrific results. Harry

DavidBarkey wrote: ↑Fri Sep 15, 2023 6:43 am

JSinMO wrote: ↑Thu Sep 14, 2023 11:12 pm

Eugen wrote: ↑Thu Sep 14, 2023 12:24 am The repair should be fine I think. I'm curious, are those rivets or how is it holding together?

No it doesn’t appear this is riveted. The “nubs” you see in the picture look to be alignment pins and are part of the casting. I question why Onan decided on a two piece intake in the first place. My guess is it came down to money and production time. Probably faster and cheaper to make them that way. It looks to me like the only thing that keeps the halves together it whatever sealant they used during assembly. It sounds like a poor idea to make it that way then I realize it’s been 50 years since they put it together at the factory so I’d say it worked pretty well!


@Harry the mating surface is kinda thin. I’m sure it could be welded but it would take someone with considerably more skill than I have.

I’ve got the intake put back together and the plan now is to reassemble the tractor tomorrow night. I guess we’ll see if I glued it up good enough!

The halves were injected molded .It had more to do with shape and smooth surfaces . Those nubs were to be longer and were peened over to hold the two halves together like rivetting with a little sealent . The peened (rivetted ) part breakes away and the come unglued . I clean them real well carefully drill out both halves and use allum rivets and bolts wrapped in tape to hold together while the JB weld (overnight stuff). cures .

I hadn’t thought of injection molding that make sense. That must have been pretty new technology at that time. I clamped the halves together while everything set up. It will have 4 studs and 2 bolts holding it on the tractor but if my concoction doesn’t hold I’ll move on the JB Weld.

Well this evening did NOT go as planned.
I put everything back together and hit the key, and the tractor came to life and sounded great! Throttled up good and ran smooth. I finished putting everything together and checked the oil. It was a little low, the engine does burn some oil when it’s working. I topped it off, closed the hood and hopped on for a test drive. I started it up, raised the blade, and went to back up and it died. Now it’s back to the same problem, no gas to the cylinders. I took it all back apart and I couldn’t see a split in the seem but the gaskets I made did not look good I should have done a better job. I fiddled around some more but I realized I’m really getting tired and making dumb mistakes like putting it back together and cranking the engine and wondering why I’m not getting fuel only to realize I didn’t hook up the impulse to the fuel pump. so I decided I needed to stop and get some rest. We have a full day of other stuff to do tomorrow and I obviously need some sleep. So at this point I don’t know what happened. I’ll have to look at it with fresh eyes another day.
I really dislike evening like this!

Oh no, one of those evenings! Sorry to hear Jeff. Good call on leaving it for another day, because last thing you want is working on it tired and maybe even get injured. You'll figure it out with a fresh mind in no time.

Those situations sound familiar to me. I always say I learn from my mistakes. I’ve been trying to slow down but it’s hard to do after always in a hurry for years. I’m sure you’ll get it running fine again Jeff. Harry

Well fellas naturally the 446 was on my mind first thing this morning! So I got up to the shop a little while before the first truck arrived to start loading out hay. I pulled the intake back off and looked things over. Seal along the seam looks good carburetor was ok but the gaskets I made weren’t worth a darn! I sat down at the bench and carefully cut a new set and reassembled the intake on the engine. What do you know it runs! . So after the first hay truck left I finished putting it all back together and went for a spin. Starts and runs just like always now! Walking away for the night was the right move, but like @Harry said it’s hard to slow down sometimes! A key takeaway here would be if you need me to turn a wrench for you thats no problem, just don’t have me make gaskets for you! She could use a rebuild for sure but that’s not on the menu for now. As long as it stars up easy and still has the power it has now, we’ll run it!

Glad it works! That's all that matters, really!

Eugen wrote: ↑Sun Sep 17, 2023 12:35 am Glad it works! That's all that matters, really!

I’m all in on that Eugen. It has to run no trailer queens in my shop. If it looked to nice I would be afraid to use it and scuff the paint. Harry

Well the weather is supposed to deteriorate around here the next couple of days. According to the news the sky is going to fall and cats and dogs are going to start living together. Latest report says up to 8” of snow with wind at 45MPH and near blizzard conditions. That would be a significant event in this area. I’m not convinced that’s going to happen but I figured I should get ready just in case.
Since I’m pretty well done with mower till spring it needs to come out of the shop. I took the trailer hitch off and put the carry all on the back. These are the weights I have. I don’t know how much they weigh but anything is better than what I have on the tractor now. The 446 sure seems to have good pulling power but these worn turf tires are absolutely useless. I could spit on the ground and it would lose traction and spin!

So now for the fun part. I have a set of free to me tire chains that I’m going to put on. Keep in mind I haven’t used chains on anything in probably 35 years! They really aren’t normally needed around here we just don’t get long term weather that would require them.

I tell you that so you’ll understand that I have no idea what I’m doing! These are for a 15” tire so there a size to small but for free I’ll try and make them work. I managed to get them around the tire now how the keep them on?

I had a couple of chain binder I found in my grandparents barn years ago there antiques for sure but they seem to work. For the inside I used rope to cinch everything up. I’m sure you fellas up in the north country are having a laugh but I’m using what I got!
I don’t know if this is going to work and I’m certainly open to critique and any suggestions any of you have to make them better. I’ll defer to you experience for sure!

There on and seem to be staying in place so I guess we’ll see. I’m about as ready as I can get for the impending snowmageddon!

What you can do to the old turfs to get better traction is to remove every other block in the tread . "Regrooving " with a hot knive . Or just opening up the width of the grooves . This concentrates the wieght on contact patch . As for the chains , making them longer and letting all the air out of the tires then reinflating once on and lined up . I fit every chain set that way .

Well I hope you don’t get the snow Jeff. But you’re ready I’d say.
Loose to snug chains give the best traction. And low tire pressure. About 7 to 8 lbs of pressure. Just my opinion.

Noel

Thanks fellas. I didn’t even think about tire pressure or letting air out before installing them. I did think about making them longer but I don’t have the time or materials at the moment to do it. These chains were on the the way to the dump I think I should see if there are anymore laying around that would make it easy to make these longer.

Great idea on grooving the tires Mr Dave! That may be my answer. Those tires are old and hard. I wonder how tough it would be to cut?
I’m going with what I have for the immediate future. They still don’t know the exact track of the storm so we could get all rain or 8” of snow. We also have 2 more chance for this crap falling into next weekend

You should be good to go. Good plan to watch for another chain to lengthen yours, keep watching something will turn up.
You know you haven't had fun putting chains on until you are buried and have to dig out just to get under your truck. At least that's what I've been told.

@JSinMO A thought for the future is to get a pair of P series snow tires for it (P is softer , better traction and ride / lt carries more weight ). They can be used year round . I beleave the size is 235-245 /75 R16 It may vary some from brand to brand . If you want to stay with the turf you have . See if there are any dirt track racers in the area . They are experts in tread cutting . Hopefully the snowmagedin passes you by and you can deal with it in the spring .

Jeff. Tire options. Rarely ever get stuck. And to make chain longer or cross chains. Just cut the link. Bend it apart so a link will slide in. Bend it back straight. I’ve never had a problem with them coming apart. Case 446

MF14, atv gator tires. Loose chains, no tighteners. Rarely ever get stuck.

John Deere. Atv gator tires. No chains. Rarely ever get stuck.

All three tractors have some weight on the back.

Options for you. Just my opinion.
Tires on the Case 446 are 6 ply which is to hard really for snow, but great for the woods or ruff terrain. Less chance of a puncture.
Not easy to have one tire for all conditions.

Noel

Noel, in the first pic I see wheel weights on the ag tires. Do you know what they were on originally? I like the way they look. Harry

@propane1 @DavidBarkey i think any of those tire options would work for me. I’m not really worried too much about puncturing a tire. The hay field is the hardest terrain I plan on taking it into. I know a guy that’s has a small automotive shop a few towns over. I’ve gotten used tires from him before to use on implements. Might be worth stopping to see if he has any snow tires laying around. I don’t really want to use turf tires. These would probably be fine if I was just mowing a nice level lawn. I’ll probably hang on to them just because but I’m gonna try and scrounge a pair up better suited to my needs.

Harry wrote: ↑Mon Jan 08, 2024 8:16 pm Noel, in the first pic I see wheel weights on the ag tires. Do you know what they were on originally? I like the way they look. Harry

The wheel weights are for front tires for farm tractors. Most two wheel drive older and maybe newer farm tractors had the same front wheels as the rear wheels on our 400 series Case tractors, other than the offset. The weights I have were off the front of a Ford 3900 two wheel drive farm tractor. But I’m guessing the are off a Fordson maybe. There is engraving on the weights. I’ll get a picture of that today and post it Harry.


Noel

Here’s a few pictures. This type of weight came on Fordson Major front wheels. And other Fords, I’m guessing. The En stood for England and the Fo for Ford, I think. The fella I bought them from said they were 75 lbs each. I never weighed then, so not sure about that. But what I know is, they were heavy to get on the wheels.

Noel

If you go back to the beginning of this thread you’ll see this tractor came to me with no brakes and who knows how many years it’s been that way. I finally decided to do something about it! A friend of mine happened to have a good brake band and the linkage is hanging on the tractor. I called over to Bob @myerslawnandgarden and he set me up with a new brake lining with an adhesive backing. He also gave me some good advice on how to attach it to the band.


I started by cleaning up the band and then I roughed up the surface with some 80 grit sandpaper so the adhesive had something to bite into. The adhesive on the lining is activated with heat. My original plan was to mount the lining and band on the brake drum then heat it up. But I realized I didn’t have much room on the tractor to work and I didn’t really like the idea of a torch next to the gas tank! So I found a big coffee can on the shelf and fit the band around it. Looks like it should work. Bob had told me to be careful about getting it too hot, so I used a propane torch and tried to apply gentle heat. I left it in place until it cooled and it worked like a charm. The lining is secure to the band! I assembled everything on the tractor and now we should have brakes! I’m hoping to have time to test drive it and do final adjustments this weekend.

I enjoyed talking with you Bob, and thanks for the help!

Jeff thanks for the terrific post. The pics helped tremendously to show what the process was. Thanks for taking the time to create the post. Harry

Thank you Harry!

I went up first thing this morning to try it out, and the brake is working fine! It’s hard to show terrain in pictures, but it is idling with the parking brake set on a hill! Not a big job but still I’m glad to mark it off the list! I feel better about son using the tractor now that it can stop!

You might remember I had ignition troubles awhile back and thought I had found and corrected the issue by replacing and rerouting the wire for the headlights. That discussion is over on the messing around in the shop thread, I thought I’d continue it here. That was back in February and I have been running the 446 regularly since with no issues, till today. It will crank fine but not even try to start.

As usual I have 19 irons in the fire so I didn’t have a lot of time to dig into it. I did grab my meter and take a quick look. I’m getting no power to the coil. The wire runs from the regulator to the coil. As a test I pulled it loose and set up a temporary jumper from the battery with an alligator clip. Tractor starts right up. I ran the wires to the dash area so I could power the coil from the drivers seat. Not ideal but at least I can run the tractor as needed till I can sit down and really look at it.

I took another look quickly this morning. I thought maybe a neutral safety switch could be the culprit, and I guess it still might be. I didn’t find anything obvious, but poking around I noticed there was a spare slot at the key and I’ll be darned its switched 12 V! That’s were I put my coil wire, at least for now.

I mentioned in my hay post that son was pushing bales with the 446 and it quit on him. I had a chance to look at it this morning. I was baling in the back field while he was running it. When I would stop I could hear him and it sounded like the tractor was sputtering a bit. Sure enough the carburetor had a plugged passage. But it still didn’t want to run right. I checked spark and it had a dead spark plug. It wouldn’t spark at all. It had Autolight 216 plugs in it and I changed them to Champion H10 that I happened to have. Now thankfully it’s back to running smoothly.

Well we had a big rain storm and our driveway needed attention when it was over. It will drain with no problem in a moderate rain but a frog strangler will wash ruts in it.
It really needed the Ford or M with the big blade, but I’m not in shape yet to be wrestling with implements. So the 446 got the call. It will do the job, it just takes a little longer.

I went to start it up, and nothing! I checked the battery and it was charged up, connections all looked good too. I connected my jump pack straight to the starter with the key on and it fired right up. I shut it off and tried again and nothing. I tapped the solenoid and it worked. So I’ll have to do a little more fiddling with it when I can but it looks like the new solenoid I put on September 7 2022 is bad. I know it’s been 2 years but that sure seems like a short life span to me. Cheaply made parts I guess.

I was able to power the starter again and get to work. I got the driveway straightened back up to an acceptable level. It sure was nice to be on a tractor again, even if it was for a short time! Sorry no pictures this time.

Good to hear you made it out and got some tractor time

@JSinMO The number one reason starter solenoids fail is Voltage Drop . Cause are low battery voltage,bad battery , poor connections , worn out starters . All motors need X # of watts to operate (volts x amps = watts ) . If the volts drop for any reason the motor will pull more amps to make up for it . This causes a slower solenoid activation time (the click) . Causing a longer and bigger arc. across the contacts in the solenoid burning the contacts out prematurely . This is more pronounced on the little tractor solenoids because instead of a rotating disk like old cars there is just a flat bar and 2 small contacts .
Poor connections can be at ....
the battery terminals
the ends of the cable to the wire
the block to the frame
at the starter terminal
starter to the block
ground cable to the block or the frame
at the solenoid

The solenoid can suffer for voltage drop as well
at any point on the power side , key switch , fuse holder, safety switches, and the wires them selves .
at any point on the ground side , safety switches , wires , main ground connections

So guys ever heard or said this one " the original part went X # years but this cheap new part didn't last long "
sometimes it is a cheap part , But usually it is one of the above that killed both .

you may keep the change

@ btw Glad you got a little seat time . I know your frustration. I have to do half of what I use to do or I greatly risk being down and out again and was warned it may need surgery next time .

@DavidBarkey Bad connections or worn out components? On one of my tractors? That doesn’t seem right!

Seriously though that’s a very good point. Whenever I get to it I’ll have to check and at least clean up the connections. I never checked the main ground now that I’m thinking about it. The tractor had a bad solenoid when I brought it home from the auction. Didn’t think much of it at the time but now you have me wondering…..

JSinMO wrote: ↑Wed Sep 04, 2024 10:52 am @DavidBarkey Bad connections or worn out components? On one of my tractors? That doesn’t seem right!

Yeah that's right Jeff, never happened to me either!