Adding an alternator

[Harry]

Dave,

I have not had to mess with the lovejoys, but I understand the crankshaft is only 1" or 1.125" long and the lovejoy must take up most of that. So the question is how do you intend on mounting a pulley in there? My first thought is to find or make a hubless pulley and weld it to the lovejoy, like the sprockets at Tractor Supply, pick the sprocket you need then pick the hub you need and weld the 2 together. Or find a pulley with a large enough bore to fit the outside of the lovejoy, then cut a keyway on the outside of the lovejoy.


Gordy

This lovejoy is 1" bore . I have no shortage of pulleys salvaged in stock. My first thought is to back cut a the lovejoy L-099 with a centering collar , drill and tap for 3 x 1/4" bolts . Take a pulley that will fit nicely in the bracket and machine corresponding bore and drill 3 mounting bolt holes to match .
I am not sure how the lovejoy would take weld as they are cintered metal . Maybe Harry would know .


Dave

I didn't know Lovejoy's were a sintered metal! As Gordy mentioned they are a metal that is made by pressing together metal particles at a high heat lower than the melting temp. They are difficult to machine and usually have a rough surface look to them. I thought that Lovejoy's were machined then hardened by heat treating. The ones I've seen on the Case tractors are aluminum. Back to the sintered metal being weldable? I would say the success would be poor.

Keep the Peace
Harry

[DavidBarkey]

Dave,

I have not had to mess with the lovejoys, but I understand the crankshaft is only 1" or 1.125" long and the lovejoy must take up most of that. So the question is how do you intend on mounting a pulley in there? My first thought is to find or make a hubless pulley and weld it to the lovejoy, like the sprockets at Tractor Supply, pick the sprocket you need then pick the hub you need and weld the 2 together. Or find a pulley with a large enough bore to fit the outside of the lovejoy, then cut a keyway on the outside of the lovejoy.


Gordy

This lovejoy is 1" bore . I have no shortage of pulleys salvaged in stock. My first thought is to back cut a the lovejoy L-099 with a centering collar , drill and tap for 3 x 1/4" bolts . Take a pulley that will fit nicely in the bracket and machine corresponding bore and drill 3 mounting bolt holes to match .
I am not sure how the lovejoy would take weld as they are cintered metal . Maybe Harry would know .


Dave

I didn't know Lovejoy's were a sintered metal! As Gordy mentioned they are a metal that is made by pressing together metal particles at a high heat lower than the melting temp. They are difficult to machine and usually have a rough surface look to them. I thought that Lovejoy's were machined then hardened by heat treating. The ones I've seen on the Case tractors are aluminum. Back to the sintered metal being weldable? I would say the success would be poor.

Keep the Peace
Harry


Hers pics of one of many what I beleave to be original of the pump. The only way I know to produce parts like this back then was EDM or Sintered . It has been a long time since I apprenticed in Machine shop so correct me if I am wrong . They are magnetic.

Dave

[DavidBarkey]

Here is the room I have to work with .

Changing to the newer style bracket and my stud being long should be able to put one in there .

Dave

[Harry]

This lovejoy is 1" bore . I have no shortage of pulleys salvaged in stock. My first thought is to back cut a the lovejoy L-099 with a centering collar , drill and tap for 3 x 1/4" bolts . Take a pulley that will fit nicely in the bracket and machine corresponding bore and drill 3 mounting bolt holes to match .
I am not sure how the lovejoy would take weld as they are cintered metal . Maybe Harry would know .


Dave

I didn't know Lovejoy's were a sintered metal! As Gordy mentioned they are a metal that is made by pressing together metal particles at a high heat lower than the melting temp. They are difficult to machine and usually have a rough surface look to them. I thought that Lovejoy's were machined then hardened by heat treating. The ones I've seen on the Case tractors are aluminum. Back to the sintered metal being weldable? I would say the success would be poor.

Keep the Peace
Harry


Hers pics of one of many what I beleave to be original of the pump. The only way I know to produce parts like this back then was EDM or Sintered . It has been a long time since I apprenticed in Machine shop so correct me if I am wrong . They are magnetic.

20220214_144105.jpg20220214_144115.jpg
Dave

If it's sintered steel, then it would be magnetic. There is sintered bronze or brass then it would not be non-magnetic.
Keep the Peace
Harry

[Spike188]

I have worked with a lot of lovejoy brand couplings.

My guess is that this one may have had a reducing bushing machined and press in place. The clue for me is the second key in the secondary bore. I have machined these units to fit where space was an issue and never came across a secondary key. Lovejoy makes these in aluminum, stainless, and steel versions.

Spike

[DavidBarkey]

I have worked with a lot of lovejoy brand couplings.
image.png
My guess is that this one may have had a reducing bushing machined and press in place. The clue for me is the second key in the secondary bore. I have machined these units to fit where space was an issue and never came across a secondary key. Lovejoy makes these in aluminum, stainless, and steel versions.

Spike

Those lines are ridges like you would find on aluminum parts and are not found on the other side .

Dave

[DavidBarkey]

Hey guys look what I found . On the lovejoy site.
Lovejoy Jaw Type couplings generally consist of two hubs (available in sintered metal, aluminum, bronze, steel, stainless steel, and ductile iron), and an elastomer element, known as a spider or cushion (materials available include NBR SOX rubber, Urethane, Hytrel®, and Bronze).

https://www.lovejoy-inc.com/products/ja ... couplings/

I Think we are all right, depending on what you have in your hand .

Dave

[thebuildist]

If it were me I'd want to re-make the engine side lovejoy coupling out of iron or soft steel. If you remade it to original dimensions and moved the set screw nearer the engine, you could weld a thin steel plate or thin iron pulley to its OD, near where the set screw currently is. I think you'd have to angle the set screw hole to get its point to be near its original location. Possible, not ideal.

My preference would be to re-make the engine side coupling to a larger OD, complete with a flange. That way a nice fat pulley ID can slide over the lovejoy OD, and rest against the flange. Because the ID of the pulley boss is larger than the OD of the spider and driven coupling, the pulley bore can safely extend out over and past the centerline of the spider. (The pulley ID has to be larger than the OD of the spider and driven coupling in order to not restrict them from lateral movement/shifting, which they must be allowed to do.)

And as you already referred to, you could drill for 3 set screws to stop the pulley from rotating around the coupling. It would probably be a little more secure if you threaded the OD of the new coupling and internal threaded the pulley bore, so that the pulley screws on and locks. But you'd probably still want to give it a set screw to prevent it from backing off. Of course, industry standard would be a keyed joint, with a single set screw in the pulley boss to lock against the key. But I don't want to spring for the cost of broaches, so I only cut keyways if I must.

As for pulley size, probably the smaller the better. Your target alternator RPM is around 6000, so with the crank going 3600, you'd like your pulley size to be no more than 2x the size of the alternator pulley.

Just my thoughts.

[DavidBarkey]

Thanks @thebuildist Bob , how have you been . Have not heard much from you these days hope you all are well . Do appreciate your input . What I was trying to get across is that I was thinking about turning a centring collar off the back of the connector . Then bolting the pulley to the back of the connector . As you say , ya steel would be preferable and is available. I think I will start by ordering a steel L-099 1" bore then work from there . I have to acquire a newer style bracket as well .
I will try to upload a pic of what I have in my head later . I have to go deal with anouther frozen down spout .

Dave

[thebuildist]

Even better yet, if you can make a pulley with the groove offset to one side of the mounting boss, you could easily attach it to a mostly unmodified lovjoy coupling:

Machine your pulley boss's ID to fit the the engine-side coupling's OD. Something around 2.115". (I got the lovejoy OD as 2.11" from the LoveJoy website. You'd want to confirm and adjust to the actual OD of your part.) Then "shoulder-drill" through one wall of the pulley boss with a 3/16" drill bit. Then with the pulley in place, finish drilling on through the shoulder of the lovejoy coupling and on out through the other wall of the pulley boss.

Then drive a 3/16" roll pin through that hole.

You still have to fabricate the special offset pulley, but the lovejoy coupling can be basically stock. The pulley could be machined out of 1" plate, with something around a 5" diameter. Aluminum would do, but corrosion will be a long-term problem. Iron or steel would be better.

Then your alternator pulley can be as small as about 2", not larger than about 6"