Just a thought about this place.

[Eugen]

@Spike188 , they say it's a blessing to be needed! Double blessing if you get paid too. Just trying to make you smile!

[JSinMO]

@Spike188 Im sorry Eugene, no curve balls allowed!
Seriously though I can absolutely relate to what you’re saying. My wife is much like yours in that regard. I try to explain why something is doing what it’s doing and I can see her eyes gloss over!

I don’t want to speak for @ssmewing but similarly to what he was saying, there have been times on the job that I have tried to teach and show how to with not even a thank you afterwards, and other times I’ve flat out said why don’t you just let me handle it I’ll let you know when it’s done!
I agree totally with what you said about management thinking anyone can do it. Not so! I went from technician into management and back to technician so I’ve kind of seen this from both sides. As a manager I had a few guys that just didn’t get it. To their credit they realize it and moved on. I only had to actually fire one person. I tried everything I knew to do to get him up to speed and it just wasn’t going to happen. It was an unpleasant experience for all involved but I was legitimately worried he might get hurt in the field.

As to the change in management style and philosophy I have experienced the same thing. Seems to me that change really took off in the early to mid 2000,s. A lot of guys that were promoted from within were retiring and the replacement managers were being hired right out of college with no practical experience. Nothing wrong with a degree but that piece of paper doesn’t mean much when it’s midnight during an ice storm and the guy that’s supposed to be leading as no clue what to do to restore service! That’s about the same time when the numbers based style of managing started. Instead of basing things on someone’s ability it all came down to metrics on a spreadsheet.

I don’t know how much of ability, or lack there of, is nature or nurture. Now I look for signs that a person wants to learn.
If they show interest then a better chance they will learn and retain. Or at least that’s the theory I’m going with!

Having the gift and ability of being mechanically inclined is a blessing. It’s a shame that at times it doesn’t feel that way.

Holy moly, two rambles in one day. I’d say that quite enough! I’ll shut up now!

[Eugen]

@JSinMO good ramble!

[ssmewing]

I obviously can’t speak to the examples you sited since I wasn’t there. I didn’t see the conversation or the context so I will only speak for myself. I’d like things to be black and white a lot more than that are. In reality they are usually some shade of grey. There are times I have to remember that people are all over the spectrum as far as knowledge goes. Take you and I as an example. I have worked on all kinds of equipment, I can confidently turn a wrench, and I have a fairly good understanding of mechanical principles. You have a very nuanced and deep understanding of Case GTs that I don’t have and I may never reach that level. Conversely there are a lot of people, especially now days, that would struggle to take the lug nuts off of a wheel. Add to that the difference in the way people learn. Some like doing the research and reading on their own, some learn better through conversations. Personally I’m a mix. Reading, talking, and I have to get my hands on it. Luckily we have a pretty good library here.
Thinking of all that I have a hard time telling someone just to go read the manual. I have no idea what their background or knowledge level is. Don’t get me wrong today’s culture dives me nuts sometimes too! But remember we are not obligated to respond to a post. At the end of the day I think we all would like to see new people coming into the community. That only happens by being welcoming and willing to share experience and knowledge. And in some cases taking baby steps.

My point to starting this thread was to express my appreciation for the civility that is found here and the, in my opinion, genuine and positive conduct of the members. Those traits are unfortunately becoming much harder to find in today’s world.

I have left some context out of what I posted.

While in a conversation with the user, where I am trying to help them, the conversation comes to a halt when you try to point them to additional knowledge that they are not aware of. It would be very rude to just say, "Look at the parts diagram; it is on the internet." I am sorry, but I will not explain that, either. It is the same when a guy is overhauling an engine and is doing it without the service manual. How do you not know someone of the 100s that you meet and converse with who does not know that almost everything can be found on the internet? And then exchange that knowledge? It must not be taught in school.

It has reached the point now that the majority are asking questions on Facebook and buying parts on Amazon. If the part is not on Amazon, they ask a Facebook group. I wish I were exaggerating, but I am not.

Then, you are right about those who either do not have the tools or the experience to remove a tire. Yet they ask someone to tell them how to fix their tractor.

It is mind-boggling that so many people are on the Internet but do not know how to do a search. I am a Boomer generation. I am the one who should be asking how to find the parts manual. The same is true for getting OEM Case parts. They have never even thought to see if there is an online site-store for original parts.

Yes, I do have a nuanced knowledge. It is not just Case tractors. I have a driven curiosity. When I got my first Case, I found and joined the forum just after the Yahoo groups had ended. Tom Arnold ran the site and apparently could see where users went on the site. He messaged me that it looks like you are trying to read all the threads on the site. I was.

I do that with everything I am interested in. I taught the classes as much as I took them. I really had no need for most of the instructors. I would read the text book and know all that I read before class. Then I could read the room. So, to get the discussion in the right direction, I asked the questions the rest of the class needed to understand, and we could move on, because I was getting bored, mainly. My math classes I did not attend except to take the test, and I was the first one done with the test. Then, I would leave.

I can do the swirl things in my head thing. I can slow things down to see them better.

My handicaps are spelling, grammar, and memory. Yes, I have a horrible memory. There is, of course, a name for the way my brain works, and of course, I cannot remember it. I can remember a complete process and all the nuances that are needed to make it work. But, do not ask me the name of it because I have about a 30% chance that I will remember it.

My writing has been enhanced a lot by paying for upgraded Grammarly. I wish I had it in college. I lost more points on the AP Research papers for spelling and grammar than I did for content. It was the Honors program that many of my previous instructors told me I should take. But, I knew that I would struggle with the writing part.

That explains why sometimes I seem unfriendly, and other times I am a great help; I am a horrible writer, speller, and keyboardist. That and I do not like lazy people who do not want the knowledge of how to fix things but yet they want to do it and not pay for it.

[ssmewing]

Let me throw a curveball here. There are times that I feel being mechanically inclined is a curse.

Part of my employment was in a manufacturing plant that started with 35 employees. All of us were hands on leaders with great teaching skills. The plant grew to almost 150 and outsourced a lot of jobs. Over time the management structure changed. Leadership was taken over by a few people that lived by the "If it is written, anyone can be trained to follow the procedure." That is categorically wrong, my spouse is living proof. Explaining why a machine has failed or how to correctly feed, or fasten a part is something that has to be intuitive. Some people have that skill and it compares to my inability to spell which drives my spouse bonkers. It drove me nuts when new management would start following the Gilbreth hand book on plant management and miss the potential of using the skills that individuals brought to the organization. The cruelest thing a manager did was pull people off of the assembly line and have them do machine maintenance for 2 weeks during plant shutdown. By the time 2 weeks were over the individual had relearned to think about how to be productive, only to be stuck back in a repetitive environment that required the simplest of tasks.

At about 15 I put new sleeves and pistons in and 1850 Oliver tractor. After splitting the tractor, the flywheel would not come off of come off of the crankshaft. The instructions in the Tractor Manual for clutch and flywheel removal was simply "Removal is obvious." For some people it is not obvious, and that is what drives me crazy. When something takes a special mechanical skill set to repair and the person assigned to the learn the job is clueless and untrainable, I go bonkers and feel cursed.

Just remember to treat others as you want to be treated. That works most of the time.

I just received service call that a robot is knocked out of alignment, at a plant 1 1/2 hours away. Nobody wants to touch it. I feel less than cursed now :wav

thats my 5 cents worth.

I can relate to that.

I also took a job installing security systems and CCTV. I was supposed to be the manager and installer to help the only other installer, who was horrible. They fired him before I started. I had skills that crossed into all of this, but I had no experience.

A little over a year later, I was an expert and was even hired to rework the work done by another company. I did service calls, and most of the time, I just had to restart the system. I would watch the camera recordings and see if there was a thunderstorm, and often that was it. Eventually, we insisted on using battery backups. I started out using the equipment technical service team to learn the systems and ended up documenting their system bugs. I could not get certified as a Master Technician because I did not have three years on the job as required, not even two years. The place I was working for was an impediment to excellence, so I left.

This stuff was all computer-based, which I was at least experienced in. I owned a business on which I installed an accounting and point-of-sale system that my accountant said I should not have been able to do, but I did it.

[JSinMO]

I have left some context out of what I posted.

While in a conversation with the user, where I am trying to help them, the conversation comes to a halt when you try to point them to additional knowledge that they are not aware of. It would be very rude to just say, "Look at the parts diagram; it is on the internet." I am sorry, but I will not explain that, either. It is the same when a guy is overhauling an engine and is doing it without the service manual. How do you not know someone of the 100s that you meet and converse with who does not know that almost everything can be found on the internet? And then exchange that knowledge? It must not be taught in school.

It has reached the point now that the majority are asking questions on Facebook and buying parts on Amazon. If the part is not on Amazon, they ask a Facebook group. I wish I were exaggerating, but I am not.

Then, you are right about those who either do not have the tools or the experience to remove a tire. Yet they ask someone to tell them how to fix their tractor.

It is mind-boggling that so many people are on the Internet but do not know how to do a search. I am a Boomer generation. I am the one who should be asking how to find the parts manual. The same is true for getting OEM Case parts. They have never even thought to see if there is an online site-store for original parts.

Yes, I do have a nuanced knowledge. It is not just Case tractors. I have a driven curiosity. When I got my first Case, I found and joined the forum just after the Yahoo groups had ended. Tom Arnold ran the site and apparently could see where users went on the site. He messaged me that it looks like you are trying to read all the threads on the site. I was.

I do that with everything I am interested in. I taught the classes as much as I took them. I really had no need for most of the instructors. I would read the text book and know all that I read before class. Then I could read the room. So, to get the discussion in the right direction, I asked the questions the rest of the class needed to understand, and we could move on, because I was getting bored, mainly. My math classes I did not attend except to take the test, and I was the first one done with the test. Then, I would leave.

I can do the swirl things in my head thing. I can slow things down to see them better.

My handicaps are spelling, grammar, and memory. Yes, I have a horrible memory. There is, of course, a name for the way my brain works, and of course, I cannot remember it. I can remember a complete process and all the nuances that are needed to make it work. But, do not ask me the name of it because I have about a 30% chance that I will remember it.

My writing has been enhanced a lot by paying for upgraded Grammarly. I wish I had it in college. I lost more points on the AP Research papers for spelling and grammar than I did for content. It was the Honors program that many of my previous instructors told me I should take. But, I knew that I would struggle with the writing part.

That explains why sometimes I seem unfriendly, and other times I am a great help; I am a horrible writer, speller, and keyboardist. That and I do not like lazy people who do not want the knowledge of how to fix things but yet they want to do it and not pay for it.

I do understand what you saying. All you can do is try to help where you can, but you’re absolutely right it can be really aggravating. Especially when you try and give the best answer you can and tell them where more information can be found and then you never hear back. Did they fix the problem? Did they give up? Who knows!

Sometimes I feel like I must be the last person on earth that isn’t a member of facebook! My has shown me things on hers and it seems to be mostly nonsense and arguments. I’m sure there is a lot of good too but I’m just not that interested in it. Market place would be about the only reason I might sign up. But then again I haul enough junk home as it is, may not be smart to have that!

This was my reason for starting this thread. Just to say thanks because we really don’t have those issues here.

Don’t feel alone, my spelling and grammar aren’t that great either, unfortunately my mathematical ability leaves a lot to be desired too !

[Harry]

I understand where you both are coming from. I was always a person that was resistant to change, but after many years of my harping on me to change I did. I took the Dale Carnegie Course that GM offered me to take for free. Then I joined Toastmaster International which really made me more confident and able to speak in front of a group. It also threw me into using a computer which opened a whole new understanding of many things. I recently signed up for Facebook just for the marketplace to sell some things not yo buy anything. I already have to much and need to let some things go. Most of my looking up items I do on my phone, which I said I would never do. So my ramble today is life is all about change. The more you change starting with small things, the open you’ll be to larger things down the road. Harry

[Harry]

Jeff I’ve noticed my FB page is entirely different than the ::wife: probably because I’ve joined Case GT sites. Harry

[ssmewing]

I also found that if you are on Facebook and when I was in the Case groups, if you copy and paste their question into a Google search bar, then make sure that the answer to the question is answered completely in that Google search, and then copy the results into a response to the question, the response to my response is never good. I was not answering the question because I did not tell them the answer. They claimed that they could have done the Google search if that was how they wanted to get the answer. That just did not make sense to me.

[Jancoe]

I know as [mention]MattA[/mention] pointed out the other day things have been a little slow here lately but it’s still a great site to be part of.

I was looking through the posts on another site and was just really disappointed in what I saw. A new member there asked a question looking for help and it devolved into an argument that got a bit ugly between long time members as well as the new user that went on for two pages. Really sad to see.

Reading that really made me appreciate our little corner of the world here. Every once in awhile I think it’s a good idea just to let everyone know how much they are appreciated for there input and work that makes this place rather special

So hats off to all of you. I hope this place will alway remain the nice place to come in and hang out that it has always been!

I haven't been on here much at all in a while. I quit the rv dealership life after 16 years and now for the last 1.5 years I've been running around doing mobile rv repair for myself. Glad I did it. Wish I'd have done it sooner. I'm only 40 but glad I didn't wait any longer. Being self employed has taken alot of extra garage activities away since I went out on my own. Winters coming soon and I'm gonna hopefully have time to build my snow cab and get a little more case/ingersoll time in. Lots of projects need tending too.


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