Colt Case Ingersoll Garden Tractors

My understanding of tires is that a hole or cut can't actually be repaired.

If a hole is small enough, you can put in a tube, so that the tube holds air instead of the tire.
If the hole is small-ish and located in the heavily cord-reinforced tread area, then you can put a plug in it.

But I think I've learned something new, something that greatly expands the repairability of tires. Low speed tires, anyway.

I watched this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JC_Kf7WSa1M which demonstrates this product:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B072Q9DBB5

That glue appears to join rubber so well that the glue joint is stronger than the rubber itself. That means that, if you're careful to consider and compensate for cord damage to the tire, that almost any puncture or tear (less than... about 5 inches?) can be repaired.

That seems like a great tool to have in my arsenal. So I've ordered a bottle, and I intend to try it next time I need it.

I not nearly confident enough that I'd try it on a passenger car right now. But I'll happily try it out on a tractor.

Am I the only one that didn't know about this?

Bob

Never knew about that product. I could have used that on a repair a few years ago.

Noel

Bob, I hate to be a party popper but is this any different than krazy glue? I have doubts it works well. Hope I am wrong.

Well, looking at reviews I am impressed. My previous experience with krazy glue was not very good. Maybe this is not the same thing. Looking forward to your impression.

That's interesting, seems like a good fix for off highway tires - I wonder though how that glue compares to the "rubber cement" you find in kits to patch inner tubes - I'm also wondering if one of those tube patches could be stuck on the outside of a tire for an emergency repair? ...or maybe fancy glue + tube patch? https://www.princessauto.com/en/17-pc-t ... 0008552267

In the video he rubs his finger right in it. I thought while watching his finger was gunna be stuck to the tire. But it didn’t at all, so it must be different than crazy glue.

Noel

@thebuildist it seems you and I have been watching similar stuff on YouTube, I just watched that video last week! I have never used that glue, but it looks like it would work. I don’t know if I would trust any sidewall patch without a tube, but if it seals…..
I’ve always made the patch inside the tire. On bigger sidewalk cuts I’ve used old mudflaps, pieces of tires laid in and then a tube and it’s worked well. On my 648 one of the front tires has a rotten ring that won’t seal around the tire. Since it’s bias ply I just added a tube and it works fine. I’ll be looking forward to you findings when you get a chance to use the glue.

In the rv repair business, slide out rubber swipe seals are joined together in the corners with super glue. Stronger than the rubber around it. Seam the same. Often destroy the rubber trying to separate then for service.

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What I don't understand is how this works. Super glue hardens like stone. So how does it hold on rubber which is changing shape as you fill up the tire with air? Obviously it works, people say so, it's kind of a miracle to me.

The thing that convinced me is when he just glued two random pieces of rubber together and then ripped them apart with pliers and it split the rubber rather than split the glue joint.

To me, that's the gold standard. I don't see how you could fake that. And if it really works like that I don't see how it could fail to work for what you need!

Bob

Okay, I received this glue today. And having taken the lid off and sniffed it, it's clearly some kind of cyanoacrylate. I presume that it's formulated in such a way to be... Effective on rubber? Maybe it's a certain way that it sets or a flexibility or something? I can't say. For the amount that I got for 12 bucks, it's not outrageously expensive. A little more than other CA glues but not way more.

Which is a long way of saying that if it really is as good on rubber as the video makes it appear then I think it'll be worth the 12 bucks. I can't wait to find out.

Bob

thebuildist wrote: ↑Sat Jan 28, 2023 6:36 pm Okay, I received this glue today. And having taken the lid off and sniffed it, it's clearly some kind of cyanoacrylate. I presume that it's formulated in such a way to be... Effective on rubber? Maybe it's a certain way that it sets or a flexibility or something? I can't say. For the amount that I got for 12 bucks, it's not outrageously expensive. A little more than other CA glues but not way more.

Which is a long way of saying that if it really is as good on rubber as the video makes it appear then I think it'll be worth the 12 bucks. I can't wait to find out.

Bob

Bob if you have an old v belt , cut the rubber up to but not through the cords from the inside .. glue back together . Then flip the belt inside out and run on a couple of flat pulleys . That would be a good test .

Do a little test for us Bob. If you have an old tire or tube, cut up two pieces and glue them together. After what ever amount of time is required to cure, then see if it will pull apart.


Noel

Drat, I wanted to get a tube and it costs $37 here in the Arctic

The real test is go stab car tire and glue back on. If you show up tomorrow alive we know it's a good glue

Thanks Bob,

I got to get some. The rubber cement that comes with patch kits is not worth a damn anymore. They must have changed the chemistry to foil the glue sniffers. I have done everything right, plus put a weight on the patch and leave it sit for 3 days and the patch will peel off easily.


Gordy

Gordy wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 12:46 am Thanks Bob,

I got to get some. The rubber cement that comes with patch kits is not worth a damn anymore. They must have changed the chemistry to foil the glue sniffers. I have done everything right, plus put a weight on the patch and leave it sit for 3 days and the patch will peel off easily.


Gordy

You are correct . Even the for shop use only products aren't what they use to be because of the VOC rules these days .

Gordy wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 12:46 am Thanks Bob,

I got to get some. The rubber cement that comes with patch kits is not worth a damn anymore. They must have changed the chemistry to foil the glue sniffers. I have done everything right, plus put a weight on the patch and leave it sit for 3 days and the patch will peel off easily.


Gordy

Hmm... guess that shows how long it's been since I patched an inner tube...

RoamingGnome wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 9:33 am

Gordy wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 12:46 am Thanks Bob,

I got to get some. The rubber cement that comes with patch kits is not worth a damn anymore. They must have changed the chemistry to foil the glue sniffers. I have done everything right, plus put a weight on the patch and leave it sit for 3 days and the patch will peel off easily.


Gordy

Hmm... guess that shows how long it's been since I patched an inner tube...

The wayyyy back machine in my brain just kicked in As a kid in the early 70's, my buddies dad had some patches for our bicycle tubes. They used a process called "vulcanization".The tube was cleaned and the patch was laid over the hole, dry/no glue. there was a special clamp that held the 2 together, then you put a lit match to the edge of the patch. The edge of the patch would flash like a very fast firecracker fuse, let it sit a couple minutes then take the clamp off and put the tube back in the tire. The heat quickly fused the 2 pieces of rubber together.


Gordy

Gordy wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 10:14 am

RoamingGnome wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 9:33 am

Gordy wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 12:46 am Thanks Bob,

I got to get some. The rubber cement that comes with patch kits is not worth a damn anymore. They must have changed the chemistry to foil the glue sniffers. I have done everything right, plus put a weight on the patch and leave it sit for 3 days and the patch will peel off easily.


Gordy

Hmm... guess that shows how long it's been since I patched an inner tube...

The wayyyy back machine in my brain just kicked in As a kid in the early 70's, my buddies dad had some patches for our bicycle tubes. They used a process called "vulcanization".The tube was cleaned and the patch was laid over the hole, dry/no glue. there was a special clamp that held the 2 together, then you put a lit match to the edge of the patch. The edge of the patch would flash like a very fast firecracker fuse, let it sit a couple minutes then take the clamp off and put the tube back in the tire. The heat quickly fused the 2 pieces of rubber together.


Gordy

Your memory jogged one of mine loose too!
One winter a neighbor kid from the next farm over said let’s go sledding. We “borrowed” a couple of his dads big tractor tubes. We poked holes in them right away. He said my dad has patches in the shop let’s fix them. They were the vulcanization ones you were talking about. By the end of the day we used all his patches and who knows how many matches! Man did we got in trouble when his dad got home! we ruined 2 tractor tire tubes and used up all the patches he had, but I guess we did learn how to patch a tube!

JSinMO wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 10:41 am Your memory jogged one of mine loose too!
One winter a neighbor kid from the next farm over said let’s go sledding. We “borrowed” a couple of his dads big tractor tubes. We poked holes in them right away. He said my dad has patches in the shop let’s fix them. They were the vulcanization ones you were talking about. By the end of the day we used all his patches and who knows how many matches! Man did we got in trouble when his dad got home! we ruined 2 tractor tire tubes and used up all the patches he had, but I guess we did learn how to patch a tube!

My sledding A$$ chewing happened at age 5 when the snow was gone. Gramps had one of those combo corn crib (outer walls) / machine sheds. I noticed the nice slope in the corn were they had been taking the cobbed corn out, Yep I took the steel runner sled in there and road it down God knows how many times A week later Gramps came for some corn and was PISSED at all of the corn knocked off the cobs


Gordy

Gordy wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 11:09 am

JSinMO wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 10:41 am Your memory jogged one of mine loose too!
One winter a neighbor kid from the next farm over said let’s go sledding. We “borrowed” a couple of his dads big tractor tubes. We poked holes in them right away. He said my dad has patches in the shop let’s fix them. They were the vulcanization ones you were talking about. By the end of the day we used all his patches and who knows how many matches! Man did we got in trouble when his dad got home! we ruined 2 tractor tire tubes and used up all the patches he had, but I guess we did learn how to patch a tube!

My sledding A$$ chewing happened at age 5 when the snow was gone. Gramps had one of those combo corn crib (outer walls) / machine sheds. I noticed the nice slope in the corn were they had been taking the cobbed corn out, Yep I took the steel runner sled in there and road it down God knows how many times A week later Gramps came for some corn and was PISSED at all of the corn knocked off the cobs


Gordy

Boy I can picture that scene! That’s sure bringing back a lot of memories. Ah the good old days!

About the second maddest I think I can remember my grandpa getting was when he came in the barn and caught me and some of my cousins walking across the beams from one side of the hay across the center alley to the other.

I also have memories of vulcanized patches. Our required roughing the area around the hole. The patch was on the bottom of a thin "lid". The lid was clamp over the area to be patched. The lid had slow a burning mixture in it. After it was lit, burned, and left to cool, the lid would release from the patch material. If the tube had not been buffed enough the patch would also lift.

You guys had me laughing out loud with stories of your antics.

Our messing with tires involved breaking watermelon open and putting a bowel shapped piece under the rear wheels of cars. The victim would find them selves stuck on dry land and had no idea why the vehicle would spin and not move. It takes a lot of tire spinning to burn through Mellon rind. Just hide and watch.

OK, so on the GT my issue was my front tires! Brand new and fitted by a dealer too. The only thing different is they were filled with beetle juice! The issue was not the tires but the wheels!!!!! The seal between the tire and wheel was compromised by rust on the rim... Had to deflate what was left of the air, remove the fill, remove the tire and then thoroughly scrub and sand the rim and repaint before remounting, filling and then pressurizing again. Did that about 4 years ago now with no new issues. No repair to the tire was needed

Gordy wrote: ↑Sun Jan 29, 2023 10:14 am
The wayyyy back machine in my brain just kicked in As a kid in the early 70's, my buddies dad had some patches for our bicycle tubes. They used a process called "vulcanization".The tube was cleaned and the patch was laid over the hole, dry/no glue. there was a special clamp that held the 2 together, then you put a lit match to the edge of the patch. The edge of the patch would flash like a very fast firecracker fuse, let it sit a couple minutes then take the clamp off and put the tube back in the tire. The heat quickly fused the 2 pieces of rubber together.


Gordy

I remember that term from when I was a kid, professional tire shops would fix tires that way. Wish that was available today!

Ok, so it's time to fire up the ol' leaf sucker.

Step one, remove the loader, step two install the ball hitch adapter on the three point. Step three, air up the tires on the leaf trailer (which are actually the rear wheels off of my first real garden tractor, a 1970 Cub Cadet that I ended up parting out about a year before I came across my first Case.)

But the tires, though I put green tire slime in them last year, for some reason refuse to hold air: It seems that sitting flat in the off season, in combination with the ancient, dried out and cracked condition of the rubber, has resulted in a big split in the sidewall.

The only reasonable conclusion is that it's tIme for new tires. But being unreasonable and cheap, I decided to try to get another season or two out of them. So I ordered a couple inner tubes.- But at 10 psi, the gash bulged open and threatened to rip even further.

So I removed the tire and sewed the split closed using my handy "Awl for all" and some heavy waxed cord/thread. And having buffed the tire near the sewing with a wire wheel in a dremel I cut some reinforced rubber out of a bicycle tire. It's not ideal, but once bonded in place, it should be strong enough.
I sanded the tread off of the bike tire to decrease its thickness and increase its pliability,
and then used the 3m Plastic and Rubber Adhesive to glue it in place. Being a form of cyanoacrylate, you only have to hold pressure on it for 4 or 5 minutes. I used some heavy bags of small hardware to try to apply broad/uniform pressure on the patch. And I used a layer of paper towel to prevent the baggies from bonding to the tire. Lastly I re-mounted the tire and installed the tube, and aired it up to 4 or 5 psi, just to get it to form. And then I bonded another piece of bike tire to the outside, really just to try to seal the gash from the elements.
It's ugly and unconventional. But I'll be surprised if I dont' get at least two seasons out of it.
Though I will be sure to block up the trailer axle during the off season this year. Sitting on flats is extra-brutal.

Finally, I went ahead and tubed the other tire as well. It didn't have a giant gash like this one, but it wouldn't hold air without a tube.

And once the tires worked, everything else fell into place. After a whiff of ether, the vacuum engine fired up and ran fine on last year's gas.

And it sure is remarkable the contrast between the heavy blanket of leaves and debris and the perfectly swept trails that the vacuum leaves behind.
Bob

You got Skillz Bob

Neat. Nice fix.

Noel

That’s a lot of work to fix a tire. I’ve picked up small tires and some on rims that people were throwing away. I’ve used some of them already on a oil tank trailer I built. My Dad would pick up other peoples junk, so I guess the apple fell not to far from the tree. Harry

That's quite the tire repair Bob -
Good example of a "never say never" attitude and if you got the tools and materials to fangle a repair... well... just getter done!

Harry wrote: ↑Thu Nov 02, 2023 7:45 am That’s a lot of work to fix a tire. I’ve picked up small tires and some on rims that people were throwing away. I’ve used some of them already on a oil tank trailer I built. My Dad would pick up other peoples junk, so I guess the apple fell not to far from the tree. Harry

I looked carefully on Facebook and craigslist for any free/cheap tires that I could mount on these 12" wheels. New tires was the only option I could find, about $125 for a pair. Not impossible, but I'm easily willing to do this work to save that expense. The two tubes were $25, and I used 1/2 of a $12 tube of glue.

I even looked for any wheels that are a similar outer diameter, thinking I could drill/tap the wheel hubs to match the new pattern. But no dice there, either.

So it is a lot of work, but it seemed like the best route available.

Bob

@thebuildist what glue is that?

viewtopic.php?p=13726#p13726

That's why I put this post in this thread.

Oh yeah, I remember you telling us about this.

Thanks for the tip on the 3M adhesive Bob. I’ll definitely be purchasing this for my arsenal. Harry

@thebuildist Bob let us know how it holds up .